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German Chancellor Olaf Scholz called Putin for the first time in two years. He seeks to win early elections and salvage his career, which is rapidly deteriorating. Moreover, there is an increasing number of articles in German media suggesting that the politician aims to conduct an election campaign for his party at Ukraine’s expense. Its main message: by not providing the Ukrainian Armed Forces with Taurus missiles, Germany averted a Third World War.
Such behaviour from a country that essentially nurtured modern Russia provokes irritation and hatred among Ukrainians
It matters little that Mr Scholz is in his final months as Chancellor. This bias against Ukraine is linked to the traumas of German society from the two World Wars, in which Germans were the aggressors, ravaging their neighbours.
I asked several people who have lived in Germany for a long time, understand its internal dynamics, and are actively involved in political processes, why Scholz places so much faith in the success of his phone calls with Putin. «Scholz and his party are not heartless or greedy scoundrels seeking to exploit others. On the contrary - unlike Ukrainian politicians, they hold ideological convictions. They are deeply convinced that their mission is to prevent Germany from scoring a hat-trick by starting a Third World War. After all, Berlin officially initiated the last two world wars. They firmly believe that preserving Germany and the lives of millions of Germans through non-involvement in wars with Russia and China is the way forward. For this, they are willing to endure any shame, condemnation, and hatred from the entire world. What’s more, they even see themselves as martyrs enduring hardships for others», a German citizen who supported the Social Democratic Party in the last two elections assured me.
Let us add to this the fears of German politicians following Donald Trump’s victory and the Republican success in the US elections. Comments from Washington, urging European countries to be more generous with security subscriptions in NATO, are growing louder.
Berlin knows these primarily concern itself, as for the last quarter of a century, Germans have built their economy on two factors - the US nuclear umbrella and cheap Russian gas
German politicians themselves nurtured the monster in human form. Therefore, it is unsurprising that former Chancellor Angela Merkel decided to rehabilitate her own reputation and that of the political elites by presenting memoirs claiming that Germany never liked Putin. It just happened that the gas deals she made with Russia were intended to benefit German companies but inadvertently gave Moscow strong confidence that Europe was no longer a serious contender.
The public behaviour of the current Chancellor Scholz and Merkel’s return to the spotlight show how modern Germany seeks to evade responsibility for its friendship with the aggressor
Germany is attempting to wriggle out of the situation again, especially as the German opposition has started suggesting the need to listen more to the US and mend relations with Trump.
Deep historical anti-Americanism has also led Scholz to humiliate himself on the phone with Putin. Meanwhile, the Kremlin dwarf, just days later, demonstratively bombards civilian districts near Ukraine’s borders. Putin shows he will not engage with those he does not respect, those who cannot decisively oppose him.
In Moscow’s ideal scenario, Putin and Donald Trump meet in a luxurious chalet in the Alps and divide the world between the two of them - perhaps three, taking China’s interests into account. However, Putin realises Germany is in deep crisis and will remain politically stagnant until spring, when a new coalition forms there. He will use this interim period for front-line escalation, blackmail, and actively terrorising Western societies with nuclear scare tactics. The question «Is Ukraine worth a Third World War?» will become part of the game.
I have an answer to this question. When the Third Reich attacked Gdańsk, justifying it as protecting German-speaking populations, few wanted to die for Poland’s interests. Even more citizens of Western states did not believe that Adolf Hitler, a seasoned infantryman from the First World War who had himself nearly died in a gas attack, would desire another world war.
However, very soon, Hitler and Stalin were dividing Poland between them - while in Soviet prisons, the flower of the Polish army was being executed, and Germans were gleefully burning Jews in Auschwitz
Nobody wanted the Second World War, thinking constructive relations with the Nazis would save them from occupation. Yet soon enough, Hitler was posing for photos under the Eiffel Tower, and his officers were downing reserves of Cointreau in French bars. Efforts to find peace with Hitler led to a situation where everyone went to war, and in the end, bombs destroyed not only Gdańsk and Warsaw.
After the Third Reich signed its surrender, Germans had to undergo denazification and pay reparations to all whose lives they had ruined. When it comes to Russia, it aims to pay no one, win the war at any cost, and, after a short pause, continue its occupation and genocide. This is the moment when the student - a simple KGB operative - surpassed his teacher, who ended his disgrace as a man by shooting himself in a bunker.
This project is co-financed by the Polish-American Freedom Foundation as part of the «Support Ukraine» programme, implemented by the Education for Democracy Foundation
20
хв
Calls to the dictator. Why is Putin laughing at Scholz’s phone diplomacy?
Maryna Danyliuk-Yarmolayeva
German Chancellor Olaf Scholz called Putin for the first time in two years. He seeks to win early elections and salvage his career, which is rapidly deteriorating. Moreover, there is an increasing number of articles in German media suggesting that the politician aims to conduct an election campaign for his party at Ukraine’s expense. Its main message: by not providing the Ukrainian Armed Forces with Taurus missiles, Germany averted a Third World War.
Such behaviour from a country that essentially nurtured modern Russia provokes irritation and hatred among Ukrainians
It matters little that Mr Scholz is in his final months as Chancellor. This bias against Ukraine is linked to the traumas of German society from the two World Wars, in which Germans were the aggressors, ravaging their neighbours.
I asked several people who have lived in Germany for a long time, understand its internal dynamics, and are actively involved in political processes, why Scholz places so much faith in the success of his phone calls with Putin. «Scholz and his party are not heartless or greedy scoundrels seeking to exploit others. On the contrary - unlike Ukrainian politicians, they hold ideological convictions. They are deeply convinced that their mission is to prevent Germany from scoring a hat-trick by starting a Third World War. After all, Berlin officially initiated the last two world wars. They firmly believe that preserving Germany and the lives of millions of Germans through non-involvement in wars with Russia and China is the way forward. For this, they are willing to endure any shame, condemnation, and hatred from the entire world. What’s more, they even see themselves as martyrs enduring hardships for others», a German citizen who supported the Social Democratic Party in the last two elections assured me.
Let us add to this the fears of German politicians following Donald Trump’s victory and the Republican success in the US elections. Comments from Washington, urging European countries to be more generous with security subscriptions in NATO, are growing louder.
Berlin knows these primarily concern itself, as for the last quarter of a century, Germans have built their economy on two factors - the US nuclear umbrella and cheap Russian gas
German politicians themselves nurtured the monster in human form. Therefore, it is unsurprising that former Chancellor Angela Merkel decided to rehabilitate her own reputation and that of the political elites by presenting memoirs claiming that Germany never liked Putin. It just happened that the gas deals she made with Russia were intended to benefit German companies but inadvertently gave Moscow strong confidence that Europe was no longer a serious contender.
The public behaviour of the current Chancellor Scholz and Merkel’s return to the spotlight show how modern Germany seeks to evade responsibility for its friendship with the aggressor
Germany is attempting to wriggle out of the situation again, especially as the German opposition has started suggesting the need to listen more to the US and mend relations with Trump.
Deep historical anti-Americanism has also led Scholz to humiliate himself on the phone with Putin. Meanwhile, the Kremlin dwarf, just days later, demonstratively bombards civilian districts near Ukraine’s borders. Putin shows he will not engage with those he does not respect, those who cannot decisively oppose him.
In Moscow’s ideal scenario, Putin and Donald Trump meet in a luxurious chalet in the Alps and divide the world between the two of them - perhaps three, taking China’s interests into account. However, Putin realises Germany is in deep crisis and will remain politically stagnant until spring, when a new coalition forms there. He will use this interim period for front-line escalation, blackmail, and actively terrorising Western societies with nuclear scare tactics. The question «Is Ukraine worth a Third World War?» will become part of the game.
I have an answer to this question. When the Third Reich attacked Gdańsk, justifying it as protecting German-speaking populations, few wanted to die for Poland’s interests. Even more citizens of Western states did not believe that Adolf Hitler, a seasoned infantryman from the First World War who had himself nearly died in a gas attack, would desire another world war.
However, very soon, Hitler and Stalin were dividing Poland between them - while in Soviet prisons, the flower of the Polish army was being executed, and Germans were gleefully burning Jews in Auschwitz
Nobody wanted the Second World War, thinking constructive relations with the Nazis would save them from occupation. Yet soon enough, Hitler was posing for photos under the Eiffel Tower, and his officers were downing reserves of Cointreau in French bars. Efforts to find peace with Hitler led to a situation where everyone went to war, and in the end, bombs destroyed not only Gdańsk and Warsaw.
After the Third Reich signed its surrender, Germans had to undergo denazification and pay reparations to all whose lives they had ruined. When it comes to Russia, it aims to pay no one, win the war at any cost, and, after a short pause, continue its occupation and genocide. This is the moment when the student - a simple KGB operative - surpassed his teacher, who ended his disgrace as a man by shooting himself in a bunker.
This project is co-financed by the Polish-American Freedom Foundation as part of the «Support Ukraine» programme, implemented by the Education for Democracy Foundation
20
хв
Calls to the dictator. Why is Putin laughing at Scholz’s phone diplomacy?
The Western world has been captivated by the new idea that Ukraine is not worth a Third World War. Supposedly, pressuring Kyiv slightly to cede territories to the Kremlin could resolve everything - allowing gas trade and selfies in front of the Kremlin to proceed smoothly
Exclusive
At the beginning of the 20th century, the newly established Ukrainian People's Republic needed brave and intelligent representatives worldwide to prove its capability as an international player, achieve recognition of the UPR as an independent state, tell the truth about Ukrainians' struggle against the Bolsheviks, and counter the fabrications of Russian propaganda.
- It needed not only male representatives but also female representatives, - says the Head of the Scientific Society of the History of Diplomacy and International Relations, Doctor of Historical Sciences, Professor Iryna Matiash. - Researching the history of Ukrainian diplomacy, I have often found that women were notable in the Ministry of Foreign Affairs or foreign missions.
«In 1917-1919, foreign missions of more than thirty countries operated in Ukrainian cities»
Olha Pakosh: You presented two of your scientific works in Krakow - «The Female Face of Ukrainian Diplomacy. Essays. Memoirs. Interviews» and «Shared Places of Memory of Ukraine and Poland. Official and Cultural Diplomacy». How did your interest in women in diplomacy begin?
Iryna Matiash: This interest arose because I have been researching the history of the diplomatic and consular service for a long time. Furthermore, I have the honour of heading the Scientific Society of the History of Diplomacy and International Relations. From 2017 (the year of 100th anniversary of the Ukrainian diplomatic service) to 2021, under the patronage of the Ministry of Foreign Affairs of Ukraine, we implemented the scientific and educational project «A Century of Ukrainian Diplomacy», organised youth meetings «European Values and Cultural Diplomacy» with the support of the Hanns Seidel Foundation in Ukraine, and launched, shortly before the full-scale invasion, the project «Ukraine - the World: 30 (104)».
However, the study of the history of Ukrainian diplomacy began even earlier when I was the Director of the Ukrainian Research Institute of Archival Affairs and Records Management.
In preparation for the 90th anniversary of the Ukrainian diplomatic service, we organised an exhibition of archival documents and showed foreign ambassadors in Kyiv the originals, which confirmed the presence of their countries' diplomatic representatives in Kyiv in 1918-1919. Since then, this topic has never left me.
Not everyone knew that the Ukrainian People's Republic and the Ukrainian State of Hetman Pavlo Skoropadskyi had official contacts with many countries and that during 1917-1919, foreign missions of more than thirty countries operated in Ukrainian cities.
Ukraine also sent its embassies and extraordinary diplomatic missions to various countries. The first UPR missions were sent to the signatory countries of the Treaty of Brest-Litovsk during the Central Rada period. Under the Hetmanate, embassies were established in Germany, Austria-Hungary, Turkey and Bulgaria, as well as in Switzerland and Finland, missions appeared in Romania and the Scandinavian states, and representatives were appointed to the Kuban government and the Government of the Don Cossacks.
The largest number of diplomatic missions was sent by the Directorate of the UPR
Between December 1918 and January 1919, diplomatic missions were sent to Belgium, the United Kingdom, Greece, Denmark, Estonia, Italy, Latvia, Poland, Romania, the Holy See, the USA, Hungary, Czechoslovakia, Sweden, Switzerland and the Caucasus to convey the truth about Ukraine and its struggle for independence to the international community.
The delegation to Paris was tasked with securing recognition of the UPR's independence by the participating states of the Paris Peace Conference, the withdrawal of foreign troops from Ukrainian territory and assistance in the fight against the Bolsheviks. To support this mission, the Ukrainian Republican Capella, led by Oleksandr Koshyts, was sent on a musical mission.
The diplomatic struggle for recognition of Ukraine's independence by European countries continued until 1926
This struggle lasted until the end of the final extraordinary diplomatic mission of the UPR in Hungary in 1924 and the formal closure of the UPR Embassy in Switzerland in 1926.
Meanwhile, Russians consistently tried to portray that Ukraine lacked diplomacy at that time and had no international contacts. By doing so, Russian scholars attempted to deny Ukraine’s statehood, as they did with other nations that were unfortunate enough to be part of the Soviet Union.
Our project «A Century of Ukrainian Diplomacy» aimed to honour Ukrainian diplomats of the Ukrainian Revolution of 1917-1921, conduct scientific and educational activities and refute Russian theses about the inability of the Ukrainian diplomatic service to function as a state institution.
In the second project, «Ukraine - The World 30 (104): Official and Cultural Diplomacy», we sought to demonstrate that Ukrainian diplomacy did not emerge after the restoration of Ukraine’s state independence but rather a century ago. It was crucial for us to preserve this historical connection and nurture institutional memory. We recorded interviews with the first ambassadors of independent Ukraine in the early 1990s, who deposited these interviews for preservation at the Central State Archive of Audiovisual and Electronic Documents.
Researching thousands of pages of archival documents for documentary exhibitions and monographs, I always subconsciously searched for women's names. I tried to answer questions such as: who was the first woman in the Ukrainian diplomatic service? Were women allowed into leadership positions? What challenges did diplomats' wives face? How did their lives turn out? This led to the idea of highlighting the role of women in diplomacy through the figures of career diplomats and diplomats' wives, as wives are also a formidable force in diplomacy. Thus, the project «The Female Face of Ukrainian Diplomacy» was born.
Repressions against Ukrainian female diplomats
- Did this inspire you to focus on the figures of women?
- Rather, it encouraged archival searches, as information about women working in diplomatic positions is quite scattered, and memoirs often contain inaccuracies and subjective assessments.
Speaking of the beginnings of Ukrainian diplomacy, it is worth mentioning the establishment of the General Secretariat of International Affairs on December 22nd 1917. It was primarily staffed by young men, with the average age of senior officials around 30. For example, Oleksandr Shulhyn was 28 when he was appointed as the first Minister of Foreign Affairs.
The first woman to hold a leadership position in the Ministry of Foreign Affairs was Nadiia Surovtsova. She entered the diplomatic service by chance but became not only the first woman to head a structural unit of the ministry but also the first spokesperson of the MFA. She began using tools that are now well-established in public diplomacy: organising an exhibition of Ukrainian embroidery and a library of Ukrainian books for the diplomatic mission at the Paris Peace Conference. Later, she used charity concerts and Ukrainian fashion shows to raise funds to support the starving in Ukraine.
By the way, in Poland, a similar position was held by Kazimiera Iłłakowiczówna, a prominent writer, poet, translator, diplomat and personal secretary to Marshal Józef Piłsudski.
As for inspiration - that would be Kateryna Hrushevska. She was the daughter of the prominent historian and head of the Ukrainian Central Rada, Mykhailo Hrushevsky, a researcher of Ukrainian folk ballads and the mythology of the world's peoples, the youngest member of the Taras Shevchenko Scientific Society in Lviv, editor of the journal «Primitive Society», an ethnologist and a victim of the repressive Soviet regime. Kateryna became one of my main heroines, prompting me to pay special attention to the figures of women in diplomacy.
Incidentally, in her mother Maria Hrushevska’s activities as the wife of the head of state (Mykhailo Hrushevsky was the head of parliament, the position of president did not exist then), one can observe the emergence of elements of public diplomacy of the first lady. According to contemporaries, Maria Hrushevska tried to correspond to her status, including in her clothing style. She followed fashion and had an appropriate wardrobe with outfits for «evening», «visiting», «strolling» and «folk» styles for participating in various cultural and social events, gatherings and business meetings. The use of vyshyvankas for public events to promote national dress can be considered an element of fashion diplomacy.
- Returning to Nadiia Surovtsova, what specifically caught your attention in her story?
- Her story is full of unexpected twists of fate. In January 1919, Nadiia Surovtsova was sent to Paris as secretary of the information bureau of the UPR delegation to participate in the Peace Conference. The plan included creating a Ukrainian library or at least a shelf of Ukrainian books. The delegation also included Dmytro Dontsov, head of the Ukrainian Telegraph Agency and Oleksandr Shulhyn, the first Minister of Foreign Affairs of the UPR.
However, most members of the delegation did not manage to reach Paris.
Returning to Kyiv was also impossible because, in early February 1919, the Bolsheviks captured the city. Many Ukrainian diplomats remained abroad. Nadiia moved to Vienna. Fluent in French and German, she initially studied at the University of Vienna and defended her dissertation on Bohdan Khmelnytsky and the Ukrainian state idea.
Soon, a diplomatic mission of Soviet Ukraine, headed by Yurii Kotsiubynsky, was established in Vienna. Among the tasks of such missions was countering the diplomatic activities of the UPR missions, which were still active in some countries. Trusting Kotsiubynsky, Surovtsova began collaborating with Soviet diplomats, participated in various events they organised and started changing her beliefs, taking an interest in the communist movement. In the spring of 1925, Nadiia returned to Kharkiv, full of hope, but she was soon repressed and exiled to Stalin’s labour camps. In exile, she realised how tragically she had been mistaken and the true evil of Soviet propaganda. She had to endure the full horrors of the GULAG.
After her release and rehabilitation, Nadiia Surovtsova returned to Uman, engaged in community activities and wrote literary works and memoirs. In her diaries, which she began writing in exile, she rethought her experiences, candidly described her mistakes and tried to erase that time from her life. Nevertheless, her diplomatic service remained the brightest part of her life.
- How did you collect materials for this research?
- That is precisely why I began discussing Nadiia Surovtsova. While reading her memoirs, I noticed certain details or inaccuracies that could only be verified through archival documents. These are scattered across various archives. The main body of archival documents related to diplomatic history, including information about Nadiia Surovtsova, is held in the Central State Archive of Supreme Authorities and Government of Ukraine. Here, one can find collections of the Ministry of Foreign Affairs of the UPR, diplomatic missions, foreign diplomatic representations and consulates, diplomats’ personal documents and diplomatic passports.
Extremely significant for such research are also the documents of Ukrainian emigrant organisations and figures, particularly those from the so-called Prague Archive, part of which is also preserved in the Central State Archive of Public Associations and Ukrainica. This unique collection of documents was declassified in the 1990s. A separate collection dedicated to Nadiia Surovtsova is stored in the Central State Archive-Museum of Literature and Art of Ukraine. Thus, her diplomatic career was reconstructed «drop by drop».
- I can imagine the meticulous work of reviewing hundreds of documents in search of one that might summarise everything previously found or, conversely, change the narrative entirely. What discovery impressed you the most?
- It should be noted that most female diplomats of the Ukrainian Revolution of 1917-1921 were forced into exile or repressed. Therefore, in addition to Ukrainian archives, it is necessary to explore foreign archives.
Also deserving attention are the cases of repressed individuals held in the Sectoral State Archive of the Security Service of Ukraine, and partially in the Central State Archive of Public Associations and Ukrainica. Archival research is a true detective story. It is captivating! I have always encouraged my students to approach research from this perspective. Search, assemble the pieces and build logical connections. This is how the necessary data can be uncovered.
One noteworthy discovery was Kateryna Hrushevska’s diary, found in the Central State Historical Archive in Kyiv within the Hrushevsky family collection. It had not been identified as Kateryna’s diary but was bound together with Maria Hrushevska’s diary. The manuscript contains valuable descriptions of their stay in Switzerland. I published this text in the Ukrainian Historical Journal.
Among the finds in foreign archives, my favourite is «The Diplomatic History of Ukraine» by Yevhen Slabchenko (Eugène Deslaw). Thanks to the «Klio» publishing house and the «Ukrainian Book» programme, this manuscript, discovered in Winnipeg, was published in Ukraine.
Another striking find was diplomatic passports. When you least expect to find a photo of the person you are researching and stumble upon an official document...
- Whose?
- It was incredibly significant for me to find Maria Bachynska’s passport. It is also preserved in the Central State Archive of Supreme Authorities and Government of Ukraine. A delicate, refined woman with a steel character, convictions and values. However, in the diplomatic passport photo, she appears rather informal.
- Maria Bachynska - she was Dmytro Dontsov’s wife, correct?
- Yes. By the way, Maria Dontsova (Bachynska) was both a woman holding a diplomatic position and the wife of a diplomatic mission staff member. Dmytro Dontsov headed the Information Bureau of the UPR Embassy in Switzerland for some time, while Maria worked as a staff member of the UPR diplomatic mission in Denmark. She was fluent in several foreign languages, which was an exceptional advantage when selecting candidates for diplomatic missions. Unfortunately, we have not yet located Maria Dontsova’s grave in New Jersey. I hope we will find it someday.
Contemporary stars and key qualities of Ukrainian diplomacy
- In modern Ukraine, female diplomats are fortunately no longer a rarity. Whom would you highlight?
- In the early 1990s, female diplomats were still a great rarity. But this was not only the case in Ukraine, it was a global trend. For instance, Nina Kovalska, Tetyana Izhevska and Natalia Zarudna recall that at the beginning of the 1990s, there were only three or four women in diplomatic positions, and the idea of a woman becoming an ambassador was entirely unrealistic.
- Who was the first female ambassador in independent Ukraine?
- After regaining independence, Nina Kovalska became the first woman appointed as an ambassador, and Natalia Zarudna became the first woman in the leadership of the Ministry of Foreign Affairs of Ukraine, serving as Deputy State Secretary of the Ministry.
In February 1998, Nina Kovalska was appointed to Switzerland and Liechtenstein, and in July, to the Holy See (Vatican) - initially concurrently, and in 2000 as a resident ambassador.
This was an unprecedented case not only in the history of relations between Ukraine and the Holy See but also in the history of Ukrainian diplomacy as a whole, as it was the first time a woman was appointed as an ambassador to such a specific place
The embassy consisted only of her and a driver, and the entire mission operated from a single room - an incredibly modest setup. Overall, I believe that our women in diplomatic positions are people with «thirty hands and thirty heads» in the best sense: they know and can do everything. Nina Kovalska exemplified this vividly: she gave interviews, hosted students, organised the first Ukrainian-Italian conference, and made maximum efforts to prepare for Pope John Paul II's visit to Ukraine despite Russian opposition. Her work was recognised both by Ukraine and the Holy See, earning her distinctions. Nina Kovalska left the Vatican at the end of her tenure with the Grand Cross of the Order of Pius IX.
After her, another extraordinary woman, Tetyana Izhevska, was appointed ambassador to the Holy See and the first ambassador of Ukraine to the Sovereign Military Order of Malta. She served there for almost 13 years. It was Tetyana Izhevska who was called a star of diplomacy by her Polish colleague.
- Has the presence of women in diplomatic service and missions influenced the quality of diplomatic service and negotiation processes?
- This seems to be a stereotype. We have debated this topic extensively, which is why we consciously chose the term «women in diplomacy» rather than «women’s diplomacy». In our concept, the notion of «women in diplomacy» encompasses career diplomats, diplomats’ wives and leaders in the field of public diplomacy. Most successful women in ambassadorial roles respond to this question in the same way: there is no such thing as «women’s» or «men’s» diplomacy - only professionalism and a calling. To be effective in diplomacy, one must always remember the well-known three keys to diplomacy of Hennadiy Udovenko: the first is professionalism, followed by patriotism and integrity.
These qualities are not dependent on gender but on the level of education, the ability to apply knowledge in practice and self-control. Psychological resilience, language skills, negotiation ability and other factors also play a crucial role. Female diplomats emphasise that a woman’s smile is not a key argument in negotiations. The defining factor is professionalism.
20
хв
Iryna Matiash: «Our female diplomats are people with thirty hands and heads. They know and can do everything»
Olga Pakosh
At the beginning of the 20th century, the newly established Ukrainian People's Republic needed brave and intelligent representatives worldwide to prove its capability as an international player, achieve recognition of the UPR as an independent state, tell the truth about Ukrainians' struggle against the Bolsheviks, and counter the fabrications of Russian propaganda.
- It needed not only male representatives but also female representatives, - says the Head of the Scientific Society of the History of Diplomacy and International Relations, Doctor of Historical Sciences, Professor Iryna Matiash. - Researching the history of Ukrainian diplomacy, I have often found that women were notable in the Ministry of Foreign Affairs or foreign missions.
«In 1917-1919, foreign missions of more than thirty countries operated in Ukrainian cities»
Olha Pakosh: You presented two of your scientific works in Krakow - «The Female Face of Ukrainian Diplomacy. Essays. Memoirs. Interviews» and «Shared Places of Memory of Ukraine and Poland. Official and Cultural Diplomacy». How did your interest in women in diplomacy begin?
Iryna Matiash: This interest arose because I have been researching the history of the diplomatic and consular service for a long time. Furthermore, I have the honour of heading the Scientific Society of the History of Diplomacy and International Relations. From 2017 (the year of 100th anniversary of the Ukrainian diplomatic service) to 2021, under the patronage of the Ministry of Foreign Affairs of Ukraine, we implemented the scientific and educational project «A Century of Ukrainian Diplomacy», organised youth meetings «European Values and Cultural Diplomacy» with the support of the Hanns Seidel Foundation in Ukraine, and launched, shortly before the full-scale invasion, the project «Ukraine - the World: 30 (104)».
However, the study of the history of Ukrainian diplomacy began even earlier when I was the Director of the Ukrainian Research Institute of Archival Affairs and Records Management.
In preparation for the 90th anniversary of the Ukrainian diplomatic service, we organised an exhibition of archival documents and showed foreign ambassadors in Kyiv the originals, which confirmed the presence of their countries' diplomatic representatives in Kyiv in 1918-1919. Since then, this topic has never left me.
Not everyone knew that the Ukrainian People's Republic and the Ukrainian State of Hetman Pavlo Skoropadskyi had official contacts with many countries and that during 1917-1919, foreign missions of more than thirty countries operated in Ukrainian cities.
Ukraine also sent its embassies and extraordinary diplomatic missions to various countries. The first UPR missions were sent to the signatory countries of the Treaty of Brest-Litovsk during the Central Rada period. Under the Hetmanate, embassies were established in Germany, Austria-Hungary, Turkey and Bulgaria, as well as in Switzerland and Finland, missions appeared in Romania and the Scandinavian states, and representatives were appointed to the Kuban government and the Government of the Don Cossacks.
The largest number of diplomatic missions was sent by the Directorate of the UPR
Between December 1918 and January 1919, diplomatic missions were sent to Belgium, the United Kingdom, Greece, Denmark, Estonia, Italy, Latvia, Poland, Romania, the Holy See, the USA, Hungary, Czechoslovakia, Sweden, Switzerland and the Caucasus to convey the truth about Ukraine and its struggle for independence to the international community.
The delegation to Paris was tasked with securing recognition of the UPR's independence by the participating states of the Paris Peace Conference, the withdrawal of foreign troops from Ukrainian territory and assistance in the fight against the Bolsheviks. To support this mission, the Ukrainian Republican Capella, led by Oleksandr Koshyts, was sent on a musical mission.
The diplomatic struggle for recognition of Ukraine's independence by European countries continued until 1926
This struggle lasted until the end of the final extraordinary diplomatic mission of the UPR in Hungary in 1924 and the formal closure of the UPR Embassy in Switzerland in 1926.
Meanwhile, Russians consistently tried to portray that Ukraine lacked diplomacy at that time and had no international contacts. By doing so, Russian scholars attempted to deny Ukraine’s statehood, as they did with other nations that were unfortunate enough to be part of the Soviet Union.
Our project «A Century of Ukrainian Diplomacy» aimed to honour Ukrainian diplomats of the Ukrainian Revolution of 1917-1921, conduct scientific and educational activities and refute Russian theses about the inability of the Ukrainian diplomatic service to function as a state institution.
In the second project, «Ukraine - The World 30 (104): Official and Cultural Diplomacy», we sought to demonstrate that Ukrainian diplomacy did not emerge after the restoration of Ukraine’s state independence but rather a century ago. It was crucial for us to preserve this historical connection and nurture institutional memory. We recorded interviews with the first ambassadors of independent Ukraine in the early 1990s, who deposited these interviews for preservation at the Central State Archive of Audiovisual and Electronic Documents.
Researching thousands of pages of archival documents for documentary exhibitions and monographs, I always subconsciously searched for women's names. I tried to answer questions such as: who was the first woman in the Ukrainian diplomatic service? Were women allowed into leadership positions? What challenges did diplomats' wives face? How did their lives turn out? This led to the idea of highlighting the role of women in diplomacy through the figures of career diplomats and diplomats' wives, as wives are also a formidable force in diplomacy. Thus, the project «The Female Face of Ukrainian Diplomacy» was born.
Repressions against Ukrainian female diplomats
- Did this inspire you to focus on the figures of women?
- Rather, it encouraged archival searches, as information about women working in diplomatic positions is quite scattered, and memoirs often contain inaccuracies and subjective assessments.
Speaking of the beginnings of Ukrainian diplomacy, it is worth mentioning the establishment of the General Secretariat of International Affairs on December 22nd 1917. It was primarily staffed by young men, with the average age of senior officials around 30. For example, Oleksandr Shulhyn was 28 when he was appointed as the first Minister of Foreign Affairs.
The first woman to hold a leadership position in the Ministry of Foreign Affairs was Nadiia Surovtsova. She entered the diplomatic service by chance but became not only the first woman to head a structural unit of the ministry but also the first spokesperson of the MFA. She began using tools that are now well-established in public diplomacy: organising an exhibition of Ukrainian embroidery and a library of Ukrainian books for the diplomatic mission at the Paris Peace Conference. Later, she used charity concerts and Ukrainian fashion shows to raise funds to support the starving in Ukraine.
By the way, in Poland, a similar position was held by Kazimiera Iłłakowiczówna, a prominent writer, poet, translator, diplomat and personal secretary to Marshal Józef Piłsudski.
As for inspiration - that would be Kateryna Hrushevska. She was the daughter of the prominent historian and head of the Ukrainian Central Rada, Mykhailo Hrushevsky, a researcher of Ukrainian folk ballads and the mythology of the world's peoples, the youngest member of the Taras Shevchenko Scientific Society in Lviv, editor of the journal «Primitive Society», an ethnologist and a victim of the repressive Soviet regime. Kateryna became one of my main heroines, prompting me to pay special attention to the figures of women in diplomacy.
Incidentally, in her mother Maria Hrushevska’s activities as the wife of the head of state (Mykhailo Hrushevsky was the head of parliament, the position of president did not exist then), one can observe the emergence of elements of public diplomacy of the first lady. According to contemporaries, Maria Hrushevska tried to correspond to her status, including in her clothing style. She followed fashion and had an appropriate wardrobe with outfits for «evening», «visiting», «strolling» and «folk» styles for participating in various cultural and social events, gatherings and business meetings. The use of vyshyvankas for public events to promote national dress can be considered an element of fashion diplomacy.
- Returning to Nadiia Surovtsova, what specifically caught your attention in her story?
- Her story is full of unexpected twists of fate. In January 1919, Nadiia Surovtsova was sent to Paris as secretary of the information bureau of the UPR delegation to participate in the Peace Conference. The plan included creating a Ukrainian library or at least a shelf of Ukrainian books. The delegation also included Dmytro Dontsov, head of the Ukrainian Telegraph Agency and Oleksandr Shulhyn, the first Minister of Foreign Affairs of the UPR.
However, most members of the delegation did not manage to reach Paris.
Returning to Kyiv was also impossible because, in early February 1919, the Bolsheviks captured the city. Many Ukrainian diplomats remained abroad. Nadiia moved to Vienna. Fluent in French and German, she initially studied at the University of Vienna and defended her dissertation on Bohdan Khmelnytsky and the Ukrainian state idea.
Soon, a diplomatic mission of Soviet Ukraine, headed by Yurii Kotsiubynsky, was established in Vienna. Among the tasks of such missions was countering the diplomatic activities of the UPR missions, which were still active in some countries. Trusting Kotsiubynsky, Surovtsova began collaborating with Soviet diplomats, participated in various events they organised and started changing her beliefs, taking an interest in the communist movement. In the spring of 1925, Nadiia returned to Kharkiv, full of hope, but she was soon repressed and exiled to Stalin’s labour camps. In exile, she realised how tragically she had been mistaken and the true evil of Soviet propaganda. She had to endure the full horrors of the GULAG.
After her release and rehabilitation, Nadiia Surovtsova returned to Uman, engaged in community activities and wrote literary works and memoirs. In her diaries, which she began writing in exile, she rethought her experiences, candidly described her mistakes and tried to erase that time from her life. Nevertheless, her diplomatic service remained the brightest part of her life.
- How did you collect materials for this research?
- That is precisely why I began discussing Nadiia Surovtsova. While reading her memoirs, I noticed certain details or inaccuracies that could only be verified through archival documents. These are scattered across various archives. The main body of archival documents related to diplomatic history, including information about Nadiia Surovtsova, is held in the Central State Archive of Supreme Authorities and Government of Ukraine. Here, one can find collections of the Ministry of Foreign Affairs of the UPR, diplomatic missions, foreign diplomatic representations and consulates, diplomats’ personal documents and diplomatic passports.
Extremely significant for such research are also the documents of Ukrainian emigrant organisations and figures, particularly those from the so-called Prague Archive, part of which is also preserved in the Central State Archive of Public Associations and Ukrainica. This unique collection of documents was declassified in the 1990s. A separate collection dedicated to Nadiia Surovtsova is stored in the Central State Archive-Museum of Literature and Art of Ukraine. Thus, her diplomatic career was reconstructed «drop by drop».
- I can imagine the meticulous work of reviewing hundreds of documents in search of one that might summarise everything previously found or, conversely, change the narrative entirely. What discovery impressed you the most?
- It should be noted that most female diplomats of the Ukrainian Revolution of 1917-1921 were forced into exile or repressed. Therefore, in addition to Ukrainian archives, it is necessary to explore foreign archives.
Also deserving attention are the cases of repressed individuals held in the Sectoral State Archive of the Security Service of Ukraine, and partially in the Central State Archive of Public Associations and Ukrainica. Archival research is a true detective story. It is captivating! I have always encouraged my students to approach research from this perspective. Search, assemble the pieces and build logical connections. This is how the necessary data can be uncovered.
One noteworthy discovery was Kateryna Hrushevska’s diary, found in the Central State Historical Archive in Kyiv within the Hrushevsky family collection. It had not been identified as Kateryna’s diary but was bound together with Maria Hrushevska’s diary. The manuscript contains valuable descriptions of their stay in Switzerland. I published this text in the Ukrainian Historical Journal.
Among the finds in foreign archives, my favourite is «The Diplomatic History of Ukraine» by Yevhen Slabchenko (Eugène Deslaw). Thanks to the «Klio» publishing house and the «Ukrainian Book» programme, this manuscript, discovered in Winnipeg, was published in Ukraine.
Another striking find was diplomatic passports. When you least expect to find a photo of the person you are researching and stumble upon an official document...
- Whose?
- It was incredibly significant for me to find Maria Bachynska’s passport. It is also preserved in the Central State Archive of Supreme Authorities and Government of Ukraine. A delicate, refined woman with a steel character, convictions and values. However, in the diplomatic passport photo, she appears rather informal.
- Maria Bachynska - she was Dmytro Dontsov’s wife, correct?
- Yes. By the way, Maria Dontsova (Bachynska) was both a woman holding a diplomatic position and the wife of a diplomatic mission staff member. Dmytro Dontsov headed the Information Bureau of the UPR Embassy in Switzerland for some time, while Maria worked as a staff member of the UPR diplomatic mission in Denmark. She was fluent in several foreign languages, which was an exceptional advantage when selecting candidates for diplomatic missions. Unfortunately, we have not yet located Maria Dontsova’s grave in New Jersey. I hope we will find it someday.
Contemporary stars and key qualities of Ukrainian diplomacy
- In modern Ukraine, female diplomats are fortunately no longer a rarity. Whom would you highlight?
- In the early 1990s, female diplomats were still a great rarity. But this was not only the case in Ukraine, it was a global trend. For instance, Nina Kovalska, Tetyana Izhevska and Natalia Zarudna recall that at the beginning of the 1990s, there were only three or four women in diplomatic positions, and the idea of a woman becoming an ambassador was entirely unrealistic.
- Who was the first female ambassador in independent Ukraine?
- After regaining independence, Nina Kovalska became the first woman appointed as an ambassador, and Natalia Zarudna became the first woman in the leadership of the Ministry of Foreign Affairs of Ukraine, serving as Deputy State Secretary of the Ministry.
In February 1998, Nina Kovalska was appointed to Switzerland and Liechtenstein, and in July, to the Holy See (Vatican) - initially concurrently, and in 2000 as a resident ambassador.
This was an unprecedented case not only in the history of relations between Ukraine and the Holy See but also in the history of Ukrainian diplomacy as a whole, as it was the first time a woman was appointed as an ambassador to such a specific place
The embassy consisted only of her and a driver, and the entire mission operated from a single room - an incredibly modest setup. Overall, I believe that our women in diplomatic positions are people with «thirty hands and thirty heads» in the best sense: they know and can do everything. Nina Kovalska exemplified this vividly: she gave interviews, hosted students, organised the first Ukrainian-Italian conference, and made maximum efforts to prepare for Pope John Paul II's visit to Ukraine despite Russian opposition. Her work was recognised both by Ukraine and the Holy See, earning her distinctions. Nina Kovalska left the Vatican at the end of her tenure with the Grand Cross of the Order of Pius IX.
After her, another extraordinary woman, Tetyana Izhevska, was appointed ambassador to the Holy See and the first ambassador of Ukraine to the Sovereign Military Order of Malta. She served there for almost 13 years. It was Tetyana Izhevska who was called a star of diplomacy by her Polish colleague.
- Has the presence of women in diplomatic service and missions influenced the quality of diplomatic service and negotiation processes?
- This seems to be a stereotype. We have debated this topic extensively, which is why we consciously chose the term «women in diplomacy» rather than «women’s diplomacy». In our concept, the notion of «women in diplomacy» encompasses career diplomats, diplomats’ wives and leaders in the field of public diplomacy. Most successful women in ambassadorial roles respond to this question in the same way: there is no such thing as «women’s» or «men’s» diplomacy - only professionalism and a calling. To be effective in diplomacy, one must always remember the well-known three keys to diplomacy of Hennadiy Udovenko: the first is professionalism, followed by patriotism and integrity.
These qualities are not dependent on gender but on the level of education, the ability to apply knowledge in practice and self-control. Psychological resilience, language skills, negotiation ability and other factors also play a crucial role. Female diplomats emphasise that a woman’s smile is not a key argument in negotiations. The defining factor is professionalism.
20
хв
Iryna Matiash: «Our female diplomats are people with thirty hands and heads. They know and can do everything»
Ukrainian diplomacy is more than a century old. No matter how hard Russian propagandists have tried to deny it, as early as the beginning of the 20th century, the UPR had representatives abroad. Sestry spoke with Professor Iryna Matiash, Head of the Board of the Scientific Society of the History of Diplomacy and International Relations, about women in Ukrainian diplomacy, their achievements and the repressions against them
Exclusive
«Women's Territory» is a nationwide organisation that has united women worldwide. Over nearly 11 years of existence, they have implemented dozens of projects, including cultural ones. The head of the organisation, Liliia Shevchenko, believes that a person who knows their roots automatically understands who they are and what they must do to preserve their country. The full-scale war has altered the organisation's operations. They have already delivered over five hundred tonnes of humanitarian aid to military personnel and civilians. They support families of prisoners of war and help women who have experienced violence. Moreover, they are expanding their presence in Europe.
Nataliia Zhukovska: Ms Liliia, you are the head of the «Women's Territory» organisation. What is this territory like?
Liliia Shevchenko: Our nationwide public organisation «Women's Territory» was founded by ideologically driven women who live and breathe Ukraine. This is not an empty phrase but the pure truth. «Women's Territory» is neither defined nor limited by borders. It is not only the territory of those residing in Ukraine but also the territory of women worldwide, especially now, when millions of Ukrainian women, fleeing war, have found temporary refuge in many European countries. We want to help them systematically. So, we decided that «Women's Territory» would now operate under the umbrella of the host country and its laws. Currently, work on the documents for «Women's Territory» in Poland is nearing completion. We have held talks with representatives from the Polish Ministry of Social Policy and with relocated Ukrainian businesses and Polish businesses. How will they help Ukrainian women in Poland? Primarily by organising Sunday schools. This is important so that children while learning about the culture of their host country, do not forget their Ukrainian heritage. Given that Ukraine is in a full-scale war and most funds from businesses and ministries are allocated to military needs, there is insufficient funding from the Ministry of Education for books and educational materials for children abroad. One of the tasks of «Women's Territory» is not only to establish Sunday schools but also to print books. We have already held talks with the «Gutenberg» publishing house. We will distribute books for free, starting with our Sunday schools.
We already have a developed base, so organising work in Poland will not be difficult. One of our members opened the first art school in Warsaw at the end of 2022 and has already received small grants from the local Polish authorities. The school offers free art classes to both Ukrainian and Polish children.
One of the messages of «Women's Territory» is that we not only take from the countries that shelter us but also give to them
We have provided Europe with qualified specialists. Due to the war in Ukraine, many educators, medical professionals and managers moved to the EU. Many of them have already had their diplomas recognised. For instance, our member, who led «Women's Territory» in Dnipro, now lives in Gdansk, has confirmed her qualifications, and is a qualified lawyer. Her mother also verified her diploma and works as a dentist. So, we offer our knowledge and services to the Polish people as well. We want the Poles to understand that they do not only give but also receive. This will also be one of the tasks of «Women's Territory» in Poland.
We will also focus on women's leadership and gender issues. A woman must understand her status and significance in society.
How has the organisation's work changed since the start of the full-scale war?
«Women's Territory» shifted 90 per cent towards volunteer activities. In Poland, for example, we partnered with several Polish foundations that had a 400-square-metre volunteer warehouse in Warsaw. We are grateful to the Poles for covering its rental costs for an extended period. It was packed to the ceiling with humanitarian aid, ranging from clothing and food to expensive medical supplies, which we distributed to Ukrainian hospitals. For example, we had diffuser devices, each costing around 2500 euros, with over a thousand in stock. We equipped hospitals with beds, X-ray machines, and vitamins. Both Ukrainians and Poles worked at the warehouse. We dispatched trucks loaded with aid based on recipients' requests and provided support to relocated family-type children's homes and care facilities for the elderly. We received tourniquets and body armour and raised funds for drones. We did not merely adapt to new challenges - we also helped others adapt to them.
Who are the members of your organisation?
There are around two thousand of us. There are women, heads of departments, who have their own public organisations and foundations. For example, our member is Iryna Mikhniuk - a widow, the wife of a fallen Hero of Ukraine. Since 2014, she has headed the organisation «Wings of the Eighth Hundred» - it consists of widows, wives of the fallen, and children. In Ukraine, there are already 19 officially registered branches of ours. The team includes women from various professions and financial backgrounds, but with a shared ideological mindset and vision. There are also military personnel, such as Viktoria Khrystenko, who was the first adviser to the Admiral of the Ukrainian Navy.
In my team, there is a board member of «Women's Territory» from Donetsk, Alina Khaletska, who was forced to flee her native city. Her family had a unique background. Her husband worked for the Donetsk administration, and she herself is a lecturer, professor and academician. They left everything behind when they fled. Upon arriving in Irpin, they worked hard to save money and eventually started purchasing a flat. Sadly, during the full-scale war, it was destroyed by an enemy shell. They endured the occupation in Irpin. In other words, they have lived through occupation twice in their lifetime. This woman was offered work abroad. Where do you think she is? In Irpin. She does not wish to leave Ukraine.
What problems do women approach you with?
Many women joined us when we became part of the coalition «Women, Peace, Security». These are activists fighting for women's leadership and supporting victims of violence. In Ukraine, this remains a major issue, especially in places like Bucha and Irpin. You are likely familiar with some of these stories. There is much I know but cannot share publicly. Our agreement is to not speak of experiences unless we were participants. I am a witness. These are stories lived by women, girls, or children. They share their stories themselves if they wish to. All stories are heavy. How do we support them? I always advocate for mutual assistance and supporting one another. It is crucial to speak with them very carefully, as every word can be traumatising.
We help them regain their footing, providing a sense of sisterhood and the reassurance that they are not alone - that we stand together
We stress that anyone could find themselves in a similar situation. Our message is one of solidarity. Sometimes, we involve these women in processes by seeking their help to show them they are needed. Engagement, even minimal, can serve as a distraction and relief. We have no formal programme for this, our approach has been refined over many years.
Additionally, through a memorandum of cooperation with municipal employment centres, we assist women in retraining and finding jobs. We collaborate closely with the Ministry of Veterans. Many of the women in «Women's Territory» are defenders who were once civilians. We were the first to help sew military uniforms and undergarments for women. We also sourced anatomical body armour specifically designed for them.
What has the organisation accomplished during its existence?
Our lives are now divided into «before» and «after» the full-scale war. Prior to it, we had a powerful project that united Ukrainian children living abroad. We also established the International Festival of Cultural and Creative Industries, known as «Women's Territory», which we later renamed «Masters' Territory». If not for the full-scale war, this festival would have received funding from the Ministry of Culture and Information Policy. It was a platform that elevated Ukrainian crafts, demonstrating that Ukrainian products are not merely sold at fairs and markets, but even in five-star hotels. For now, this project has been put on hold. Today, we focus on uniting Ukrainian women abroad.
We strive to ensure that Ukraine is not forgotten. Our initial focus is on registering «Women's Territory» in Poland and France. Next, we plan for Belgium, Switzerland, Germany and Spain
We have provided female defenders with over 1200 boxes containing first-aid kits, vitamins, special olive-based creams to prevent skin cracking and even perfumes.
Every woman should feel like a woman, no matter where she is. We even provided hair dye tailored to their colour types. Once, I asked the women to take photos for a media campaign to raise funds for these boxes. They sent back pictures - clean, with hairstyles and manicures. It turned out they had travelled to a district centre and, using their own money, found skilled manicure artists and hairdressers. They told me, «Lilia, when we opened these boxes, we felt like we were at home». You see, they received a psychological breath of happiness.
Your organisation has helped women with children evacuate from dangerous areas to avoid occupation. How did this happen, and how many people have you assisted?
We do not have exact numbers on how many people we have helped. We evacuated people from Melitopol, Berdyansk, Kherson, Donetsk region, and the left, already occupied, bank of the Zaporizhzhia region. Of course, we were assisted by the military. I am unsure if I am allowed to disclose the details of every rescue story. I will share one - the story of a mother with two children who were leaving Melitopol. At that time, her daughter was 15, and her son was three years old. Their father was in the Armed Forces of Ukraine. If the Russians had found this out, they would have been executed. She instructed her children to remain silent and, if necessary, to respond only in Russian. On their way, Russian soldiers armed with weapons boarded the bus to conduct checks. Approaching them, the muzzle of a rifle hanging on one soldier's shoulder accidentally pressed against the child's head. The boy was so terrified that he wets himself to this day. They were interrogated, their phone SIM cards were examined, and the family endured multiple rounds of hell. It later turned out they were fortunate that the child was not undressed. Only later did the mother notice a hidden sheet of A4 paper on her son's chest. On it was a drawing of his father in military uniform, with a flag and the words «Glory to Ukraine!». The boy had placed that drawing there himself. To him, it represented Ukraine, his life. If the Russians had seen that drawing, they would have been executed. We have many such stories.
Do you keep in touch with the families you have assisted?
Someday, I will revisit those lists. But for now, our priority is to officially establish «Women's Territory» in Europe and America. We are resilient, genuine, and active. We are women accustomed to giving, not taking. Perhaps in time, I will become more interested in the fates of those we have helped. However, I often question whether reaching out would be beneficial or if it might unintentionally bring harm.
You travel abroad frequently. What do you talk about there, how do foreigners react, and what interests them most?
I talk about the solidarity and resilience of the Ukrainian people. I share the harsh realities of war we face, the immense challenges, and our efforts to overcome them. My message is always framed to emphasise the need for support in these efforts. I say, «We are taking action, not standing by. Help us in this war in any way you can - through expertise, humanitarian aid, or military support». We consistently highlight the need to support the Ukrainian army, and I know our message is being heard.
«Women's Territory» supports prisoners of war and continuously participates in various campaigns. Do you believe these efforts contribute to exchanges?
Absolutely. We have been supporting the families of prisoners of war since the start of the war in 2014. We organise events with the mothers, wives, and children of captured marines. Do you remember those taken prisoner in Crimea at the beginning of the war? We brought the mother and daughter of one of the marines to the UN so that their speech could raise awareness and tell the truth about the war in Ukraine. Any information campaign must be planned and ongoing. Such initiatives not only ensure that the world does not forget those in captivity but also help the relatives of prisoners of war feel they are not alone, preventing them from being lost in their grief. Tragedy unites. We have many poignant stories related to the return of prisoners of war. Recently, there was a soldier on the list who had been eagerly awaited by everyone. They thought he had come back. However, it turned out it was not him. The surname was the same, but the first name was different.
You also conduct training sessions for government institutions on communication with veterans and their families. What are the key principles you focus on?
I will illustrate with the example of the Kyiv City Employment Centre. Engaging with a military veteran, a defender or a servicewoman, requires a particular approach. For instance, we - as empaths - often feel the urge to approach a soldier on the street and say, «Thank you for your service. Glory to Ukraine». We might want to hug them and say, «You are a hero!». Yet, almost none of this should be said or done. These are triggers. If you call them heroes, they often do not perceive themselves that way. This is why we educate not only employees of state institutions but also the civilian population. The most important thing is teaching how to understand and engage with these individuals. For example, when they come to the Kyiv City Employment Centre, the manager who interacts with them must be highly qualified and aware that every soldier might experience flashbacks. We train them to pay attention to facial expressions, eyes, and behaviour. Employees of such institutions must be prepared for any possible scenario because almost all soldiers have experienced concussions. Furthermore, there must be barrier-free access and inclusivity.
Veterans must be actively involved in rebuilding Ukraine after the war, not left idle at home
Sociologists warn of a crisis facing the country after the war, particularly a demographic one. Do you think Ukrainian women will return from Europe after the victory? What steps are needed to ensure this?
I am unsure if I can speak openly about this, but yes, we are facing a demographic crisis. A baby boom will not be enough to solve this. We are exploring solutions because it concerns our future. Will women return from abroad? The longer the full-scale war continues, the less likely it becomes. Many divorces are happening now. Numerous women have adapted to their children's needs, and most of these children are assimilating into the societies where they now live. We have already encountered such cases among my members. They lived abroad. The daughter wanted to return, but the son did not. He had adapted, made friends, and was better accepted in his class than he had been at home. He likes the new country.
We must understand that parents' decisions will be influenced by their children. Therefore, we need to prioritise working with children abroad
Moreover, many women abroad have managed to realise themselves better or earn more than they did at home. For example, she was a nurse in a hospital in western Ukraine, and now she works as a nurse in Wroclaw. In Poland, she earns significantly more. Our officials must listen to society and start developing a programme to bring Ukrainian women home today. «Women's Territory» will undoubtedly contribute to this effort, primarily with its experience and resources. After all, we live in this country - to defend, revive, and provide it with a future. Fortunately, the majority of «Women's Territory» members abroad understand this.
20
хв
Head of «Women's Territory» Liliia Shevchenko: «We give women a sense of sisterhood»
Nataliia Zhukovska
«Women's Territory» is a nationwide organisation that has united women worldwide. Over nearly 11 years of existence, they have implemented dozens of projects, including cultural ones. The head of the organisation, Liliia Shevchenko, believes that a person who knows their roots automatically understands who they are and what they must do to preserve their country. The full-scale war has altered the organisation's operations. They have already delivered over five hundred tonnes of humanitarian aid to military personnel and civilians. They support families of prisoners of war and help women who have experienced violence. Moreover, they are expanding their presence in Europe.
Nataliia Zhukovska: Ms Liliia, you are the head of the «Women's Territory» organisation. What is this territory like?
Liliia Shevchenko: Our nationwide public organisation «Women's Territory» was founded by ideologically driven women who live and breathe Ukraine. This is not an empty phrase but the pure truth. «Women's Territory» is neither defined nor limited by borders. It is not only the territory of those residing in Ukraine but also the territory of women worldwide, especially now, when millions of Ukrainian women, fleeing war, have found temporary refuge in many European countries. We want to help them systematically. So, we decided that «Women's Territory» would now operate under the umbrella of the host country and its laws. Currently, work on the documents for «Women's Territory» in Poland is nearing completion. We have held talks with representatives from the Polish Ministry of Social Policy and with relocated Ukrainian businesses and Polish businesses. How will they help Ukrainian women in Poland? Primarily by organising Sunday schools. This is important so that children while learning about the culture of their host country, do not forget their Ukrainian heritage. Given that Ukraine is in a full-scale war and most funds from businesses and ministries are allocated to military needs, there is insufficient funding from the Ministry of Education for books and educational materials for children abroad. One of the tasks of «Women's Territory» is not only to establish Sunday schools but also to print books. We have already held talks with the «Gutenberg» publishing house. We will distribute books for free, starting with our Sunday schools.
We already have a developed base, so organising work in Poland will not be difficult. One of our members opened the first art school in Warsaw at the end of 2022 and has already received small grants from the local Polish authorities. The school offers free art classes to both Ukrainian and Polish children.
One of the messages of «Women's Territory» is that we not only take from the countries that shelter us but also give to them
We have provided Europe with qualified specialists. Due to the war in Ukraine, many educators, medical professionals and managers moved to the EU. Many of them have already had their diplomas recognised. For instance, our member, who led «Women's Territory» in Dnipro, now lives in Gdansk, has confirmed her qualifications, and is a qualified lawyer. Her mother also verified her diploma and works as a dentist. So, we offer our knowledge and services to the Polish people as well. We want the Poles to understand that they do not only give but also receive. This will also be one of the tasks of «Women's Territory» in Poland.
We will also focus on women's leadership and gender issues. A woman must understand her status and significance in society.
How has the organisation's work changed since the start of the full-scale war?
«Women's Territory» shifted 90 per cent towards volunteer activities. In Poland, for example, we partnered with several Polish foundations that had a 400-square-metre volunteer warehouse in Warsaw. We are grateful to the Poles for covering its rental costs for an extended period. It was packed to the ceiling with humanitarian aid, ranging from clothing and food to expensive medical supplies, which we distributed to Ukrainian hospitals. For example, we had diffuser devices, each costing around 2500 euros, with over a thousand in stock. We equipped hospitals with beds, X-ray machines, and vitamins. Both Ukrainians and Poles worked at the warehouse. We dispatched trucks loaded with aid based on recipients' requests and provided support to relocated family-type children's homes and care facilities for the elderly. We received tourniquets and body armour and raised funds for drones. We did not merely adapt to new challenges - we also helped others adapt to them.
Who are the members of your organisation?
There are around two thousand of us. There are women, heads of departments, who have their own public organisations and foundations. For example, our member is Iryna Mikhniuk - a widow, the wife of a fallen Hero of Ukraine. Since 2014, she has headed the organisation «Wings of the Eighth Hundred» - it consists of widows, wives of the fallen, and children. In Ukraine, there are already 19 officially registered branches of ours. The team includes women from various professions and financial backgrounds, but with a shared ideological mindset and vision. There are also military personnel, such as Viktoria Khrystenko, who was the first adviser to the Admiral of the Ukrainian Navy.
In my team, there is a board member of «Women's Territory» from Donetsk, Alina Khaletska, who was forced to flee her native city. Her family had a unique background. Her husband worked for the Donetsk administration, and she herself is a lecturer, professor and academician. They left everything behind when they fled. Upon arriving in Irpin, they worked hard to save money and eventually started purchasing a flat. Sadly, during the full-scale war, it was destroyed by an enemy shell. They endured the occupation in Irpin. In other words, they have lived through occupation twice in their lifetime. This woman was offered work abroad. Where do you think she is? In Irpin. She does not wish to leave Ukraine.
What problems do women approach you with?
Many women joined us when we became part of the coalition «Women, Peace, Security». These are activists fighting for women's leadership and supporting victims of violence. In Ukraine, this remains a major issue, especially in places like Bucha and Irpin. You are likely familiar with some of these stories. There is much I know but cannot share publicly. Our agreement is to not speak of experiences unless we were participants. I am a witness. These are stories lived by women, girls, or children. They share their stories themselves if they wish to. All stories are heavy. How do we support them? I always advocate for mutual assistance and supporting one another. It is crucial to speak with them very carefully, as every word can be traumatising.
We help them regain their footing, providing a sense of sisterhood and the reassurance that they are not alone - that we stand together
We stress that anyone could find themselves in a similar situation. Our message is one of solidarity. Sometimes, we involve these women in processes by seeking their help to show them they are needed. Engagement, even minimal, can serve as a distraction and relief. We have no formal programme for this, our approach has been refined over many years.
Additionally, through a memorandum of cooperation with municipal employment centres, we assist women in retraining and finding jobs. We collaborate closely with the Ministry of Veterans. Many of the women in «Women's Territory» are defenders who were once civilians. We were the first to help sew military uniforms and undergarments for women. We also sourced anatomical body armour specifically designed for them.
What has the organisation accomplished during its existence?
Our lives are now divided into «before» and «after» the full-scale war. Prior to it, we had a powerful project that united Ukrainian children living abroad. We also established the International Festival of Cultural and Creative Industries, known as «Women's Territory», which we later renamed «Masters' Territory». If not for the full-scale war, this festival would have received funding from the Ministry of Culture and Information Policy. It was a platform that elevated Ukrainian crafts, demonstrating that Ukrainian products are not merely sold at fairs and markets, but even in five-star hotels. For now, this project has been put on hold. Today, we focus on uniting Ukrainian women abroad.
We strive to ensure that Ukraine is not forgotten. Our initial focus is on registering «Women's Territory» in Poland and France. Next, we plan for Belgium, Switzerland, Germany and Spain
We have provided female defenders with over 1200 boxes containing first-aid kits, vitamins, special olive-based creams to prevent skin cracking and even perfumes.
Every woman should feel like a woman, no matter where she is. We even provided hair dye tailored to their colour types. Once, I asked the women to take photos for a media campaign to raise funds for these boxes. They sent back pictures - clean, with hairstyles and manicures. It turned out they had travelled to a district centre and, using their own money, found skilled manicure artists and hairdressers. They told me, «Lilia, when we opened these boxes, we felt like we were at home». You see, they received a psychological breath of happiness.
Your organisation has helped women with children evacuate from dangerous areas to avoid occupation. How did this happen, and how many people have you assisted?
We do not have exact numbers on how many people we have helped. We evacuated people from Melitopol, Berdyansk, Kherson, Donetsk region, and the left, already occupied, bank of the Zaporizhzhia region. Of course, we were assisted by the military. I am unsure if I am allowed to disclose the details of every rescue story. I will share one - the story of a mother with two children who were leaving Melitopol. At that time, her daughter was 15, and her son was three years old. Their father was in the Armed Forces of Ukraine. If the Russians had found this out, they would have been executed. She instructed her children to remain silent and, if necessary, to respond only in Russian. On their way, Russian soldiers armed with weapons boarded the bus to conduct checks. Approaching them, the muzzle of a rifle hanging on one soldier's shoulder accidentally pressed against the child's head. The boy was so terrified that he wets himself to this day. They were interrogated, their phone SIM cards were examined, and the family endured multiple rounds of hell. It later turned out they were fortunate that the child was not undressed. Only later did the mother notice a hidden sheet of A4 paper on her son's chest. On it was a drawing of his father in military uniform, with a flag and the words «Glory to Ukraine!». The boy had placed that drawing there himself. To him, it represented Ukraine, his life. If the Russians had seen that drawing, they would have been executed. We have many such stories.
Do you keep in touch with the families you have assisted?
Someday, I will revisit those lists. But for now, our priority is to officially establish «Women's Territory» in Europe and America. We are resilient, genuine, and active. We are women accustomed to giving, not taking. Perhaps in time, I will become more interested in the fates of those we have helped. However, I often question whether reaching out would be beneficial or if it might unintentionally bring harm.
You travel abroad frequently. What do you talk about there, how do foreigners react, and what interests them most?
I talk about the solidarity and resilience of the Ukrainian people. I share the harsh realities of war we face, the immense challenges, and our efforts to overcome them. My message is always framed to emphasise the need for support in these efforts. I say, «We are taking action, not standing by. Help us in this war in any way you can - through expertise, humanitarian aid, or military support». We consistently highlight the need to support the Ukrainian army, and I know our message is being heard.
«Women's Territory» supports prisoners of war and continuously participates in various campaigns. Do you believe these efforts contribute to exchanges?
Absolutely. We have been supporting the families of prisoners of war since the start of the war in 2014. We organise events with the mothers, wives, and children of captured marines. Do you remember those taken prisoner in Crimea at the beginning of the war? We brought the mother and daughter of one of the marines to the UN so that their speech could raise awareness and tell the truth about the war in Ukraine. Any information campaign must be planned and ongoing. Such initiatives not only ensure that the world does not forget those in captivity but also help the relatives of prisoners of war feel they are not alone, preventing them from being lost in their grief. Tragedy unites. We have many poignant stories related to the return of prisoners of war. Recently, there was a soldier on the list who had been eagerly awaited by everyone. They thought he had come back. However, it turned out it was not him. The surname was the same, but the first name was different.
You also conduct training sessions for government institutions on communication with veterans and their families. What are the key principles you focus on?
I will illustrate with the example of the Kyiv City Employment Centre. Engaging with a military veteran, a defender or a servicewoman, requires a particular approach. For instance, we - as empaths - often feel the urge to approach a soldier on the street and say, «Thank you for your service. Glory to Ukraine». We might want to hug them and say, «You are a hero!». Yet, almost none of this should be said or done. These are triggers. If you call them heroes, they often do not perceive themselves that way. This is why we educate not only employees of state institutions but also the civilian population. The most important thing is teaching how to understand and engage with these individuals. For example, when they come to the Kyiv City Employment Centre, the manager who interacts with them must be highly qualified and aware that every soldier might experience flashbacks. We train them to pay attention to facial expressions, eyes, and behaviour. Employees of such institutions must be prepared for any possible scenario because almost all soldiers have experienced concussions. Furthermore, there must be barrier-free access and inclusivity.
Veterans must be actively involved in rebuilding Ukraine after the war, not left idle at home
Sociologists warn of a crisis facing the country after the war, particularly a demographic one. Do you think Ukrainian women will return from Europe after the victory? What steps are needed to ensure this?
I am unsure if I can speak openly about this, but yes, we are facing a demographic crisis. A baby boom will not be enough to solve this. We are exploring solutions because it concerns our future. Will women return from abroad? The longer the full-scale war continues, the less likely it becomes. Many divorces are happening now. Numerous women have adapted to their children's needs, and most of these children are assimilating into the societies where they now live. We have already encountered such cases among my members. They lived abroad. The daughter wanted to return, but the son did not. He had adapted, made friends, and was better accepted in his class than he had been at home. He likes the new country.
We must understand that parents' decisions will be influenced by their children. Therefore, we need to prioritise working with children abroad
Moreover, many women abroad have managed to realise themselves better or earn more than they did at home. For example, she was a nurse in a hospital in western Ukraine, and now she works as a nurse in Wroclaw. In Poland, she earns significantly more. Our officials must listen to society and start developing a programme to bring Ukrainian women home today. «Women's Territory» will undoubtedly contribute to this effort, primarily with its experience and resources. After all, we live in this country - to defend, revive, and provide it with a future. Fortunately, the majority of «Women's Territory» members abroad understand this.
20
хв
Head of «Women's Territory» Liliia Shevchenko: «We give women a sense of sisterhood»
They help evacuate from war-affected regions, endure violence, restore documents and preserve Ukrainian identity abroad. On the work of «Women's Territory» in Ukraine and Europe - in the Sestry article
Exclusive
IWONA REICHARDT: You were in the United States during the final stages of the presidential campaign, and you witnessed the results in Ukraine. Were they a surprise to you?
TAMAR JACOBY: I was – it was a punch in the gut. But I shouldn't have been surprised. Now that I look at the results, I think we all should have seen it coming. We told ourselves it was 50-50, but it wasn't 50-50. Trump won by a significant margin. I don't blame the polling – I don’t think that’s the main problem. I think that people just didn't want to see a Trump victory coming. I certainly didn't want to see it. Now we need to accept that Americans have embraced Donald Trump.
It's hard to understand why exactly. Is it that voters don't believe he'll do all the crazy things he says he will do? Or is it that they really just don't like the direction that Democrats were taking the country? Why this wholehearted embrace? I’m still struggling to understand it. But clearly Americans have embraced Trump, and we are going to have to accept the choice and live with it for four years.
Speaking of the crazy stuff you mentioned, one of Trump’s promises is to end the war in Ukraine in a day, something which seems inconceivable…
Yes, Ukrainian social media had a field day with that in the first days after the election: “The clock is ticking. Don, where is the peace?” But jokes aside, I don't think he will be able to end the war in a day. I think he will find it harder to end than he thinks.
The big question will be what kind of deal does he propose? I'm very concerned about some of the deals that his advisors have suggested. The second question is how will Putin react? The response from Russia in the last two or three days has not been particularly forthcoming. The third question will be how seriously will Trump stick with his proposal? If you remember his negotiations with North Korea in the first term, he gave up after just a few days of talks.
So yes, there are many questions about his promise to end the war in 24 hours. Also, when he says he's going to walk away from Ukraine – in fact he hasn't said that exactly, but people have read his comments to mean that. We don’t know what he intends. Does he mean no new weapons from the US, or an end to all support? Or does he mean that the US will continue to provide intelligence and let the Europeans provide military aid, including by purchasing US weapons?
Bottom line: there are many versions of what could happen now, and I think people should focus on making arguments that might persuade Trump to do the right thing rather than immediately assuming he’ll do the worst
What do you think success would mean for Trump when it comes to ending the war in Ukraine?
We don't know yet. Trump is a very reactive, emotional person. So, a lot depends on how it plays out. He won’t react well if he feels that Putin is snubbing him – that could work to Ukraine’s advantage. And he won’t like it if it looks like America has somehow failed and betrayed its ally. So we just have to see. There are many unknowns and many things that need to play out. What’s important now is to try to help Trump see Ukraine in a frame that could be positive.
This gets us to the Trump-Putin relationship. Who is Putin for Trump? A friend or a foe?
Unclear. But he is still definitely a foe for Ukraine and the rest of the West. And nothing suggests a change of attitude among ordinary Russians. Ukrainian social media monitors Russian social media very closely, and there’s been a lot of talk in recent days about how America is still Russia’s enemy and America will always be Russia’s enemy. One Ukrainian headline quoted a Russian saying, “Same jerk, different face” – meaning Trump is no different from Biden, And a lot of that attitude is fanned by Putin and his allies.
The big question about the negotiations is what will Trump put on the table?
If Putin walks away, I can imagine there would be consequences – I could see Trump hammering him hard. The question is, why would he walk away? If Trump proposes a freezing of the front line and a Ukrainian promise not to join NATO, why would Putin walk away? That’s my biggest concern. But again, we just don't know.
Also, let’s not forget about the fourth big player – Europe. You have Ukraine, you have the US, you have Russia, but you also have Europe. And Europe has to get its act together and step up. We could see a scenario where Trump backs away but says “Europe, it’s your responsibility”. Europe then has to find the money and the weapons, and step in. Europeans have been talking about these responsibilities since the war began, but they haven't really done much to increase their military capacity. Poland is spending more, but Germany is still spending almost nothing, and the German government has just collapsed. That is why I'm as concerned about what's going on in Europe as I am about what's happening in the US.
Do you think Europe, and especially countries such as Poland or the Baltic states, should worry right now? Does Trump’s victory mean we are more at risk of war coming to our door?
The bottom line is that Europe has to step up. No matter who is president of the United States. Even if Kamala Harris had won, Europe would need to get going. It is not enough to talk the talk – “We have to spend more”. Europeans have to allocate the money and cooperate with each other to make every dollar go as far it can. And they have to do it efficiently. There has been a lot of talk, but the train has not left the station. I understand – things take time in Brussels, and it's complicated. But come on, hurry up. People are dying in eastern Ukraine. And this war will come to Europe’s doorstep. The threats are already on your doorstep. And in this regard, I think Trump’s election might actually help – might push the Europeans to act in a way that the situation on the front line hasn’t pushed them.
Speaking about the front line, and the overall situation in Ukraine, all the prognoses are not optimistic…
It's not good. The Russians are relying more and more heavily on glide bombs, a brutal tactic. They destroy the place they're trying to take, and then they send in men. And nobody has figured out how to counter these attacks. These are old-fashioned aerial bombs with wings, and they're huge. When they hit, they can destroy whole buildings. And that's what the Russians have done – destroyed city after city.
Meanwhile, Ukraine’s ammunition is dwindling, and the men are tired. As I understand things, this summer’s mobilization drive has largely fizzled out, and desertions are up. The Ukrainian public is still hanging in there. Opinion polls don’t show much change in attitudes toward the war over the last six months.
Life is amazingly normal in Kyiv. For me, it's great to be back. But people are tired, and I think they are waiting to see how Trump’s election will change the dynamic
Ukrainians are so tired of fighting with one hand tied behind their back, getting some American and European weaponry but not enough and not permitted to use it as they think it should be used. I lot of people are eager for something bolder – and many think that may be Trump. Many people are worried about him, but some people are hopeful. Maybe Trump will break something – will somehow break the logjam.
Do you feel the sense of abandonment in Ukraine? Do Ukrainians feel abandoned by the West, by Poland, by the US?
Those countries aren’t all the same. I think most Poles understand what is going on in Ukraine – understand the existential Russian threat. Most Europeans get it. But most Americans do not get it. They don't understand the stakes or the magnitude of the threat, unfortunately. For most Americans, this war is very far away. And their view of the stakes is more transactional than existential. But even in Europe, let’s be honest, there is more talk than action. Abandonment is a big word, but maybe it's not far from the truth. It's becoming a lonely fight for Ukraine.
What is America going to do now, during this period when Joe Biden is a lame duck and Donald Trump is president-elect?
I do not think there will be another supplemental funding package from Congress. I just don't see it. Both the House and the Senate are now Republican and under Trump’s sway. Still, a few things could happen between now and January.
We haven't spent all the money from the last supplemental, and we should rush to do that
Senator Lindsey Graham has an interesting idea: giving Ukraine the same status as Israel, opening the way to much wider access to US weapons. It's not quite NATO membership, but it's a lot better than what Ukraine has now. We should also be looking at the rules that govern how American defense contractors can cooperate with contractors in other countries.
Many of these are small things, but the point is it's way too soon to give up. There are things that can be done in the US, things that can be done in Europe. Maybe most important is what Zelenskyy and others are doing – thinking about what arguments will be most compelling to the Trump team. All of these steps can make a difference, and we have to go on. The war is not over. Ukrainians are still fighting, and Russia looks as menacing as ever, for Ukraine and the rest of Europe.
Cover photo: 24th Mechanised Brigade named after King Danylo of the Ukrainian Armed Forces/AFP/East News
20
хв
Tamar Jacoby: It may become a lonely fight for Ukraine
Iwona Reichardt
Ексклюзив
IWONA REICHARDT: You were in the United States during the final stages of the presidential campaign, and you witnessed the results in Ukraine. Were they a surprise to you?
TAMAR JACOBY: I was – it was a punch in the gut. But I shouldn't have been surprised. Now that I look at the results, I think we all should have seen it coming. We told ourselves it was 50-50, but it wasn't 50-50. Trump won by a significant margin. I don't blame the polling – I don’t think that’s the main problem. I think that people just didn't want to see a Trump victory coming. I certainly didn't want to see it. Now we need to accept that Americans have embraced Donald Trump.
It's hard to understand why exactly. Is it that voters don't believe he'll do all the crazy things he says he will do? Or is it that they really just don't like the direction that Democrats were taking the country? Why this wholehearted embrace? I’m still struggling to understand it. But clearly Americans have embraced Trump, and we are going to have to accept the choice and live with it for four years.
Speaking of the crazy stuff you mentioned, one of Trump’s promises is to end the war in Ukraine in a day, something which seems inconceivable…
Yes, Ukrainian social media had a field day with that in the first days after the election: “The clock is ticking. Don, where is the peace?” But jokes aside, I don't think he will be able to end the war in a day. I think he will find it harder to end than he thinks.
The big question will be what kind of deal does he propose? I'm very concerned about some of the deals that his advisors have suggested. The second question is how will Putin react? The response from Russia in the last two or three days has not been particularly forthcoming. The third question will be how seriously will Trump stick with his proposal? If you remember his negotiations with North Korea in the first term, he gave up after just a few days of talks.
So yes, there are many questions about his promise to end the war in 24 hours. Also, when he says he's going to walk away from Ukraine – in fact he hasn't said that exactly, but people have read his comments to mean that. We don’t know what he intends. Does he mean no new weapons from the US, or an end to all support? Or does he mean that the US will continue to provide intelligence and let the Europeans provide military aid, including by purchasing US weapons?
Bottom line: there are many versions of what could happen now, and I think people should focus on making arguments that might persuade Trump to do the right thing rather than immediately assuming he’ll do the worst
What do you think success would mean for Trump when it comes to ending the war in Ukraine?
We don't know yet. Trump is a very reactive, emotional person. So, a lot depends on how it plays out. He won’t react well if he feels that Putin is snubbing him – that could work to Ukraine’s advantage. And he won’t like it if it looks like America has somehow failed and betrayed its ally. So we just have to see. There are many unknowns and many things that need to play out. What’s important now is to try to help Trump see Ukraine in a frame that could be positive.
This gets us to the Trump-Putin relationship. Who is Putin for Trump? A friend or a foe?
Unclear. But he is still definitely a foe for Ukraine and the rest of the West. And nothing suggests a change of attitude among ordinary Russians. Ukrainian social media monitors Russian social media very closely, and there’s been a lot of talk in recent days about how America is still Russia’s enemy and America will always be Russia’s enemy. One Ukrainian headline quoted a Russian saying, “Same jerk, different face” – meaning Trump is no different from Biden, And a lot of that attitude is fanned by Putin and his allies.
The big question about the negotiations is what will Trump put on the table?
If Putin walks away, I can imagine there would be consequences – I could see Trump hammering him hard. The question is, why would he walk away? If Trump proposes a freezing of the front line and a Ukrainian promise not to join NATO, why would Putin walk away? That’s my biggest concern. But again, we just don't know.
Also, let’s not forget about the fourth big player – Europe. You have Ukraine, you have the US, you have Russia, but you also have Europe. And Europe has to get its act together and step up. We could see a scenario where Trump backs away but says “Europe, it’s your responsibility”. Europe then has to find the money and the weapons, and step in. Europeans have been talking about these responsibilities since the war began, but they haven't really done much to increase their military capacity. Poland is spending more, but Germany is still spending almost nothing, and the German government has just collapsed. That is why I'm as concerned about what's going on in Europe as I am about what's happening in the US.
Do you think Europe, and especially countries such as Poland or the Baltic states, should worry right now? Does Trump’s victory mean we are more at risk of war coming to our door?
The bottom line is that Europe has to step up. No matter who is president of the United States. Even if Kamala Harris had won, Europe would need to get going. It is not enough to talk the talk – “We have to spend more”. Europeans have to allocate the money and cooperate with each other to make every dollar go as far it can. And they have to do it efficiently. There has been a lot of talk, but the train has not left the station. I understand – things take time in Brussels, and it's complicated. But come on, hurry up. People are dying in eastern Ukraine. And this war will come to Europe’s doorstep. The threats are already on your doorstep. And in this regard, I think Trump’s election might actually help – might push the Europeans to act in a way that the situation on the front line hasn’t pushed them.
Speaking about the front line, and the overall situation in Ukraine, all the prognoses are not optimistic…
It's not good. The Russians are relying more and more heavily on glide bombs, a brutal tactic. They destroy the place they're trying to take, and then they send in men. And nobody has figured out how to counter these attacks. These are old-fashioned aerial bombs with wings, and they're huge. When they hit, they can destroy whole buildings. And that's what the Russians have done – destroyed city after city.
Meanwhile, Ukraine’s ammunition is dwindling, and the men are tired. As I understand things, this summer’s mobilization drive has largely fizzled out, and desertions are up. The Ukrainian public is still hanging in there. Opinion polls don’t show much change in attitudes toward the war over the last six months.
Life is amazingly normal in Kyiv. For me, it's great to be back. But people are tired, and I think they are waiting to see how Trump’s election will change the dynamic
Ukrainians are so tired of fighting with one hand tied behind their back, getting some American and European weaponry but not enough and not permitted to use it as they think it should be used. I lot of people are eager for something bolder – and many think that may be Trump. Many people are worried about him, but some people are hopeful. Maybe Trump will break something – will somehow break the logjam.
Do you feel the sense of abandonment in Ukraine? Do Ukrainians feel abandoned by the West, by Poland, by the US?
Those countries aren’t all the same. I think most Poles understand what is going on in Ukraine – understand the existential Russian threat. Most Europeans get it. But most Americans do not get it. They don't understand the stakes or the magnitude of the threat, unfortunately. For most Americans, this war is very far away. And their view of the stakes is more transactional than existential. But even in Europe, let’s be honest, there is more talk than action. Abandonment is a big word, but maybe it's not far from the truth. It's becoming a lonely fight for Ukraine.
What is America going to do now, during this period when Joe Biden is a lame duck and Donald Trump is president-elect?
I do not think there will be another supplemental funding package from Congress. I just don't see it. Both the House and the Senate are now Republican and under Trump’s sway. Still, a few things could happen between now and January.
We haven't spent all the money from the last supplemental, and we should rush to do that
Senator Lindsey Graham has an interesting idea: giving Ukraine the same status as Israel, opening the way to much wider access to US weapons. It's not quite NATO membership, but it's a lot better than what Ukraine has now. We should also be looking at the rules that govern how American defense contractors can cooperate with contractors in other countries.
Many of these are small things, but the point is it's way too soon to give up. There are things that can be done in the US, things that can be done in Europe. Maybe most important is what Zelenskyy and others are doing – thinking about what arguments will be most compelling to the Trump team. All of these steps can make a difference, and we have to go on. The war is not over. Ukrainians are still fighting, and Russia looks as menacing as ever, for Ukraine and the rest of Europe.
Cover photo: 24th Mechanised Brigade named after King Danylo of the Ukrainian Armed Forces/AFP/East News
20
хв
Tamar Jacoby: It may become a lonely fight for Ukraine
«The war is not over. Ukrainians are still fighting, and Russia appears more threatening than ever to Ukraine and the rest of Europe» - an interview with Tamara Jacoby, an American reporter and Kyiv director of the «New Ukraine» project at the Institute for Progressive Policy
Exclusive
For the longest time it has been my dream to move to America but after living there for three years, I decided to move back to Poland. Just like my parents, I thought that living in America was going to offer me this big American dream, but that was not the case. I think due to the ways in which America is portrayed, I had this preconceived notion of what my life is going to look like but I was unaware of the jarring realisations that come with moving to the West.
When I got there I wouldn't say that I missed my old life in Poland. Everything felt new and exciting and I felt like «I made it» but the longer I spent time in the US the more I realised the sad realities of America. Life in the East is highly focused on community: I know my neighbours, I get my fruits and vegetables from a local market stand, my friends buy me beers when I’m out of cash, but my experience in America was the complete opposite of that. Unless you’re in a borough where you grew up or have built a community, all your experiences are transactional. I found myself thinking that I’m forming a relationship with someone to quickly later on finding that they wanted something from me, blurring the line whether friendships can exist outside of work or status.
What was the most difficult for me when I was there was really understanding my identity in the realm of the US
In America, I am perceived as a white girl and my identity as a Polish person is not necessarily considered unless I bring it up in a conversation. This was really difficult for me to understand because I feel like I'm coming from a country that focuses on identity so much. I felt like that was just being stripped away. I couldn't really identify myself with where I lay in the US. Should I be considered an immigrant or should I be considered a Polish American? It was really unclear for me. I was aware of the privileges that I have in America due to being a white woman but I couldn’t identify or relate to the white American women around me.
I didn't really feel at home there unless I was in a neighbourhood such as Greenpoint where I was able to socialise with Polish people, and when it came to my university, I only met one other Polish person. It wasn't until I became friends with a Ukrainian guy who came from an immigrant family. He understood exactly what I was talking about. The Americans only perceived him as a white boy and he was unable to identify with white American men either. We would discuss our similarities and differences of being Polish and Ukrainian and the terror that's happening in the world right now that most of our peers in America seemed to ignore. I think that America is so centralised in its country and politics that a lot of issues outside that don’t concern people there just seem to be irrelevant and I think especially when you are an immigrant you can find yourself feeling lost.
That friend of mine made me realise how much I miss my country and how much I miss my community because he was the closest to what felt like a community to me in America. It's a weird experience to be an Eastern European because, on one hand, most Eastern European countries have been historically oppressed but on the other hand, you do carry the privilege of being a white person and should hold yourself accountable for having that privilege.
It's just not talked about enough how much history affected Eastern European countries and especially in the West I don't see many people being aware of what happened.
I remember how in one of my classes an American kid didn’t even know about what’s happening in Ukraine. «What war?» they said and I couldn’t believe what I was hearing
I got so angry, how can one not know? Everything there is centralised in their country, excluding anything that doesn’t focus on it or on their ideals of individualism. I couldn't take it anymore - «America this, America that», - no news about another country, while their country is one responsible for most war crimes in the world and is simultaneously one able to stop these wars.
In New York, I lived in the Ukrainian neighbourhood of the East Village, hoping it would bring me a sense of peace. Instead, I found it felt rather fabricated. I didn’t hear any Ukrainian on the streets, and most of the neighbourhood seemed to be gentrified by hipster white Americans and students looking for affordable housing. I often found myself wondering what this meant for those who once called the neighbourhood home.
The contrast between the original culture and the modern, more commercialised environment evoked a sense of nostalgia for what was lost, which was only enhanced by what is happening in Ukraine right now
Similarly, I saw the same thing taking place in Greenpoint. What was once known as a thriving Polish neighbourhood was no longer the same. Each month I’d go - another restaurant would get shut down and another person I’d known would move out since they could no longer afford it. What struck me most was the change in the people around me. Many residents who lived there for a long time were being pushed out due to rising rents, and the cultural landscape I had initially felt in a way at home, began to feel more homogenised. Both Ukrainian and Polish communities were pushed out of neighbourhoods they once considered their own, now they move a couple miles further away from Manhattan to another neighbourhood they will call home until it happens again.
All my time while I was in America I questioned: why not choose the calmer, community life? Why is this the dream? Feeling isolated in the four walls of my New York apartment, waking up every day to the loud noises outside, seeing faces I don’t recognise every day. Why not move back home and have community, support and a sense of safety? I realised that as I was complaining about all of this I only had one option. I packed my things and I left. My dream is not to be surrounded by shiny things and a job that boosts my sense of self. I want to feel like I belong somewhere, a place where neighbours say hi to each other, a place where others take care of each other, a place we can call home.
20
хв
Why I am coming back East
Melania Krych
For the longest time it has been my dream to move to America but after living there for three years, I decided to move back to Poland. Just like my parents, I thought that living in America was going to offer me this big American dream, but that was not the case. I think due to the ways in which America is portrayed, I had this preconceived notion of what my life is going to look like but I was unaware of the jarring realisations that come with moving to the West.
When I got there I wouldn't say that I missed my old life in Poland. Everything felt new and exciting and I felt like «I made it» but the longer I spent time in the US the more I realised the sad realities of America. Life in the East is highly focused on community: I know my neighbours, I get my fruits and vegetables from a local market stand, my friends buy me beers when I’m out of cash, but my experience in America was the complete opposite of that. Unless you’re in a borough where you grew up or have built a community, all your experiences are transactional. I found myself thinking that I’m forming a relationship with someone to quickly later on finding that they wanted something from me, blurring the line whether friendships can exist outside of work or status.
What was the most difficult for me when I was there was really understanding my identity in the realm of the US
In America, I am perceived as a white girl and my identity as a Polish person is not necessarily considered unless I bring it up in a conversation. This was really difficult for me to understand because I feel like I'm coming from a country that focuses on identity so much. I felt like that was just being stripped away. I couldn't really identify myself with where I lay in the US. Should I be considered an immigrant or should I be considered a Polish American? It was really unclear for me. I was aware of the privileges that I have in America due to being a white woman but I couldn’t identify or relate to the white American women around me.
I didn't really feel at home there unless I was in a neighbourhood such as Greenpoint where I was able to socialise with Polish people, and when it came to my university, I only met one other Polish person. It wasn't until I became friends with a Ukrainian guy who came from an immigrant family. He understood exactly what I was talking about. The Americans only perceived him as a white boy and he was unable to identify with white American men either. We would discuss our similarities and differences of being Polish and Ukrainian and the terror that's happening in the world right now that most of our peers in America seemed to ignore. I think that America is so centralised in its country and politics that a lot of issues outside that don’t concern people there just seem to be irrelevant and I think especially when you are an immigrant you can find yourself feeling lost.
That friend of mine made me realise how much I miss my country and how much I miss my community because he was the closest to what felt like a community to me in America. It's a weird experience to be an Eastern European because, on one hand, most Eastern European countries have been historically oppressed but on the other hand, you do carry the privilege of being a white person and should hold yourself accountable for having that privilege.
It's just not talked about enough how much history affected Eastern European countries and especially in the West I don't see many people being aware of what happened.
I remember how in one of my classes an American kid didn’t even know about what’s happening in Ukraine. «What war?» they said and I couldn’t believe what I was hearing
I got so angry, how can one not know? Everything there is centralised in their country, excluding anything that doesn’t focus on it or on their ideals of individualism. I couldn't take it anymore - «America this, America that», - no news about another country, while their country is one responsible for most war crimes in the world and is simultaneously one able to stop these wars.
In New York, I lived in the Ukrainian neighbourhood of the East Village, hoping it would bring me a sense of peace. Instead, I found it felt rather fabricated. I didn’t hear any Ukrainian on the streets, and most of the neighbourhood seemed to be gentrified by hipster white Americans and students looking for affordable housing. I often found myself wondering what this meant for those who once called the neighbourhood home.
The contrast between the original culture and the modern, more commercialised environment evoked a sense of nostalgia for what was lost, which was only enhanced by what is happening in Ukraine right now
Similarly, I saw the same thing taking place in Greenpoint. What was once known as a thriving Polish neighbourhood was no longer the same. Each month I’d go - another restaurant would get shut down and another person I’d known would move out since they could no longer afford it. What struck me most was the change in the people around me. Many residents who lived there for a long time were being pushed out due to rising rents, and the cultural landscape I had initially felt in a way at home, began to feel more homogenised. Both Ukrainian and Polish communities were pushed out of neighbourhoods they once considered their own, now they move a couple miles further away from Manhattan to another neighbourhood they will call home until it happens again.
All my time while I was in America I questioned: why not choose the calmer, community life? Why is this the dream? Feeling isolated in the four walls of my New York apartment, waking up every day to the loud noises outside, seeing faces I don’t recognise every day. Why not move back home and have community, support and a sense of safety? I realised that as I was complaining about all of this I only had one option. I packed my things and I left. My dream is not to be surrounded by shiny things and a job that boosts my sense of self. I want to feel like I belong somewhere, a place where neighbours say hi to each other, a place where others take care of each other, a place we can call home.
20
хв
Why I am coming back East
I want to feel like I belong somewhere - a place where neighbours say hi and people look after one another
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Iryna Matiash: «Our female diplomats are people with thirty hands and heads. They know and can do everything»
Olga Pakosh
At the beginning of the 20th century, the newly established Ukrainian People's Republic needed brave and intelligent representatives worldwide to prove its capability as an international player, achieve recognition of the UPR as an independent state, tell the truth about Ukrainians' struggle against the Bolsheviks, and counter the fabrications of Russian propaganda.
- It needed not only male representatives but also female representatives, - says the Head of the Scientific Society of the History of Diplomacy and International Relations, Doctor of Historical Sciences, Professor Iryna Matiash. - Researching the history of Ukrainian diplomacy, I have often found that women were notable in the Ministry of Foreign Affairs or foreign missions.
«In 1917-1919, foreign missions of more than thirty countries operated in Ukrainian cities»
Olha Pakosh: You presented two of your scientific works in Krakow - «The Female Face of Ukrainian Diplomacy. Essays. Memoirs. Interviews» and «Shared Places of Memory of Ukraine and Poland. Official and Cultural Diplomacy». How did your interest in women in diplomacy begin?
Iryna Matiash: This interest arose because I have been researching the history of the diplomatic and consular service for a long time. Furthermore, I have the honour of heading the Scientific Society of the History of Diplomacy and International Relations. From 2017 (the year of 100th anniversary of the Ukrainian diplomatic service) to 2021, under the patronage of the Ministry of Foreign Affairs of Ukraine, we implemented the scientific and educational project «A Century of Ukrainian Diplomacy», organised youth meetings «European Values and Cultural Diplomacy» with the support of the Hanns Seidel Foundation in Ukraine, and launched, shortly before the full-scale invasion, the project «Ukraine - the World: 30 (104)».
However, the study of the history of Ukrainian diplomacy began even earlier when I was the Director of the Ukrainian Research Institute of Archival Affairs and Records Management.
In preparation for the 90th anniversary of the Ukrainian diplomatic service, we organised an exhibition of archival documents and showed foreign ambassadors in Kyiv the originals, which confirmed the presence of their countries' diplomatic representatives in Kyiv in 1918-1919. Since then, this topic has never left me.
Not everyone knew that the Ukrainian People's Republic and the Ukrainian State of Hetman Pavlo Skoropadskyi had official contacts with many countries and that during 1917-1919, foreign missions of more than thirty countries operated in Ukrainian cities.
Ukraine also sent its embassies and extraordinary diplomatic missions to various countries. The first UPR missions were sent to the signatory countries of the Treaty of Brest-Litovsk during the Central Rada period. Under the Hetmanate, embassies were established in Germany, Austria-Hungary, Turkey and Bulgaria, as well as in Switzerland and Finland, missions appeared in Romania and the Scandinavian states, and representatives were appointed to the Kuban government and the Government of the Don Cossacks.
The largest number of diplomatic missions was sent by the Directorate of the UPR
Between December 1918 and January 1919, diplomatic missions were sent to Belgium, the United Kingdom, Greece, Denmark, Estonia, Italy, Latvia, Poland, Romania, the Holy See, the USA, Hungary, Czechoslovakia, Sweden, Switzerland and the Caucasus to convey the truth about Ukraine and its struggle for independence to the international community.
The delegation to Paris was tasked with securing recognition of the UPR's independence by the participating states of the Paris Peace Conference, the withdrawal of foreign troops from Ukrainian territory and assistance in the fight against the Bolsheviks. To support this mission, the Ukrainian Republican Capella, led by Oleksandr Koshyts, was sent on a musical mission.
The diplomatic struggle for recognition of Ukraine's independence by European countries continued until 1926
This struggle lasted until the end of the final extraordinary diplomatic mission of the UPR in Hungary in 1924 and the formal closure of the UPR Embassy in Switzerland in 1926.
Meanwhile, Russians consistently tried to portray that Ukraine lacked diplomacy at that time and had no international contacts. By doing so, Russian scholars attempted to deny Ukraine’s statehood, as they did with other nations that were unfortunate enough to be part of the Soviet Union.
Our project «A Century of Ukrainian Diplomacy» aimed to honour Ukrainian diplomats of the Ukrainian Revolution of 1917-1921, conduct scientific and educational activities and refute Russian theses about the inability of the Ukrainian diplomatic service to function as a state institution.
In the second project, «Ukraine - The World 30 (104): Official and Cultural Diplomacy», we sought to demonstrate that Ukrainian diplomacy did not emerge after the restoration of Ukraine’s state independence but rather a century ago. It was crucial for us to preserve this historical connection and nurture institutional memory. We recorded interviews with the first ambassadors of independent Ukraine in the early 1990s, who deposited these interviews for preservation at the Central State Archive of Audiovisual and Electronic Documents.
Researching thousands of pages of archival documents for documentary exhibitions and monographs, I always subconsciously searched for women's names. I tried to answer questions such as: who was the first woman in the Ukrainian diplomatic service? Were women allowed into leadership positions? What challenges did diplomats' wives face? How did their lives turn out? This led to the idea of highlighting the role of women in diplomacy through the figures of career diplomats and diplomats' wives, as wives are also a formidable force in diplomacy. Thus, the project «The Female Face of Ukrainian Diplomacy» was born.
Repressions against Ukrainian female diplomats
- Did this inspire you to focus on the figures of women?
- Rather, it encouraged archival searches, as information about women working in diplomatic positions is quite scattered, and memoirs often contain inaccuracies and subjective assessments.
Speaking of the beginnings of Ukrainian diplomacy, it is worth mentioning the establishment of the General Secretariat of International Affairs on December 22nd 1917. It was primarily staffed by young men, with the average age of senior officials around 30. For example, Oleksandr Shulhyn was 28 when he was appointed as the first Minister of Foreign Affairs.
The first woman to hold a leadership position in the Ministry of Foreign Affairs was Nadiia Surovtsova. She entered the diplomatic service by chance but became not only the first woman to head a structural unit of the ministry but also the first spokesperson of the MFA. She began using tools that are now well-established in public diplomacy: organising an exhibition of Ukrainian embroidery and a library of Ukrainian books for the diplomatic mission at the Paris Peace Conference. Later, she used charity concerts and Ukrainian fashion shows to raise funds to support the starving in Ukraine.
By the way, in Poland, a similar position was held by Kazimiera Iłłakowiczówna, a prominent writer, poet, translator, diplomat and personal secretary to Marshal Józef Piłsudski.
As for inspiration - that would be Kateryna Hrushevska. She was the daughter of the prominent historian and head of the Ukrainian Central Rada, Mykhailo Hrushevsky, a researcher of Ukrainian folk ballads and the mythology of the world's peoples, the youngest member of the Taras Shevchenko Scientific Society in Lviv, editor of the journal «Primitive Society», an ethnologist and a victim of the repressive Soviet regime. Kateryna became one of my main heroines, prompting me to pay special attention to the figures of women in diplomacy.
Incidentally, in her mother Maria Hrushevska’s activities as the wife of the head of state (Mykhailo Hrushevsky was the head of parliament, the position of president did not exist then), one can observe the emergence of elements of public diplomacy of the first lady. According to contemporaries, Maria Hrushevska tried to correspond to her status, including in her clothing style. She followed fashion and had an appropriate wardrobe with outfits for «evening», «visiting», «strolling» and «folk» styles for participating in various cultural and social events, gatherings and business meetings. The use of vyshyvankas for public events to promote national dress can be considered an element of fashion diplomacy.
- Returning to Nadiia Surovtsova, what specifically caught your attention in her story?
- Her story is full of unexpected twists of fate. In January 1919, Nadiia Surovtsova was sent to Paris as secretary of the information bureau of the UPR delegation to participate in the Peace Conference. The plan included creating a Ukrainian library or at least a shelf of Ukrainian books. The delegation also included Dmytro Dontsov, head of the Ukrainian Telegraph Agency and Oleksandr Shulhyn, the first Minister of Foreign Affairs of the UPR.
However, most members of the delegation did not manage to reach Paris.
Returning to Kyiv was also impossible because, in early February 1919, the Bolsheviks captured the city. Many Ukrainian diplomats remained abroad. Nadiia moved to Vienna. Fluent in French and German, she initially studied at the University of Vienna and defended her dissertation on Bohdan Khmelnytsky and the Ukrainian state idea.
Soon, a diplomatic mission of Soviet Ukraine, headed by Yurii Kotsiubynsky, was established in Vienna. Among the tasks of such missions was countering the diplomatic activities of the UPR missions, which were still active in some countries. Trusting Kotsiubynsky, Surovtsova began collaborating with Soviet diplomats, participated in various events they organised and started changing her beliefs, taking an interest in the communist movement. In the spring of 1925, Nadiia returned to Kharkiv, full of hope, but she was soon repressed and exiled to Stalin’s labour camps. In exile, she realised how tragically she had been mistaken and the true evil of Soviet propaganda. She had to endure the full horrors of the GULAG.
After her release and rehabilitation, Nadiia Surovtsova returned to Uman, engaged in community activities and wrote literary works and memoirs. In her diaries, which she began writing in exile, she rethought her experiences, candidly described her mistakes and tried to erase that time from her life. Nevertheless, her diplomatic service remained the brightest part of her life.
- How did you collect materials for this research?
- That is precisely why I began discussing Nadiia Surovtsova. While reading her memoirs, I noticed certain details or inaccuracies that could only be verified through archival documents. These are scattered across various archives. The main body of archival documents related to diplomatic history, including information about Nadiia Surovtsova, is held in the Central State Archive of Supreme Authorities and Government of Ukraine. Here, one can find collections of the Ministry of Foreign Affairs of the UPR, diplomatic missions, foreign diplomatic representations and consulates, diplomats’ personal documents and diplomatic passports.
Extremely significant for such research are also the documents of Ukrainian emigrant organisations and figures, particularly those from the so-called Prague Archive, part of which is also preserved in the Central State Archive of Public Associations and Ukrainica. This unique collection of documents was declassified in the 1990s. A separate collection dedicated to Nadiia Surovtsova is stored in the Central State Archive-Museum of Literature and Art of Ukraine. Thus, her diplomatic career was reconstructed «drop by drop».
- I can imagine the meticulous work of reviewing hundreds of documents in search of one that might summarise everything previously found or, conversely, change the narrative entirely. What discovery impressed you the most?
- It should be noted that most female diplomats of the Ukrainian Revolution of 1917-1921 were forced into exile or repressed. Therefore, in addition to Ukrainian archives, it is necessary to explore foreign archives.
Also deserving attention are the cases of repressed individuals held in the Sectoral State Archive of the Security Service of Ukraine, and partially in the Central State Archive of Public Associations and Ukrainica. Archival research is a true detective story. It is captivating! I have always encouraged my students to approach research from this perspective. Search, assemble the pieces and build logical connections. This is how the necessary data can be uncovered.
One noteworthy discovery was Kateryna Hrushevska’s diary, found in the Central State Historical Archive in Kyiv within the Hrushevsky family collection. It had not been identified as Kateryna’s diary but was bound together with Maria Hrushevska’s diary. The manuscript contains valuable descriptions of their stay in Switzerland. I published this text in the Ukrainian Historical Journal.
Among the finds in foreign archives, my favourite is «The Diplomatic History of Ukraine» by Yevhen Slabchenko (Eugène Deslaw). Thanks to the «Klio» publishing house and the «Ukrainian Book» programme, this manuscript, discovered in Winnipeg, was published in Ukraine.
Another striking find was diplomatic passports. When you least expect to find a photo of the person you are researching and stumble upon an official document...
- Whose?
- It was incredibly significant for me to find Maria Bachynska’s passport. It is also preserved in the Central State Archive of Supreme Authorities and Government of Ukraine. A delicate, refined woman with a steel character, convictions and values. However, in the diplomatic passport photo, she appears rather informal.
- Maria Bachynska - she was Dmytro Dontsov’s wife, correct?
- Yes. By the way, Maria Dontsova (Bachynska) was both a woman holding a diplomatic position and the wife of a diplomatic mission staff member. Dmytro Dontsov headed the Information Bureau of the UPR Embassy in Switzerland for some time, while Maria worked as a staff member of the UPR diplomatic mission in Denmark. She was fluent in several foreign languages, which was an exceptional advantage when selecting candidates for diplomatic missions. Unfortunately, we have not yet located Maria Dontsova’s grave in New Jersey. I hope we will find it someday.
Contemporary stars and key qualities of Ukrainian diplomacy
- In modern Ukraine, female diplomats are fortunately no longer a rarity. Whom would you highlight?
- In the early 1990s, female diplomats were still a great rarity. But this was not only the case in Ukraine, it was a global trend. For instance, Nina Kovalska, Tetyana Izhevska and Natalia Zarudna recall that at the beginning of the 1990s, there were only three or four women in diplomatic positions, and the idea of a woman becoming an ambassador was entirely unrealistic.
- Who was the first female ambassador in independent Ukraine?
- After regaining independence, Nina Kovalska became the first woman appointed as an ambassador, and Natalia Zarudna became the first woman in the leadership of the Ministry of Foreign Affairs of Ukraine, serving as Deputy State Secretary of the Ministry.
In February 1998, Nina Kovalska was appointed to Switzerland and Liechtenstein, and in July, to the Holy See (Vatican) - initially concurrently, and in 2000 as a resident ambassador.
This was an unprecedented case not only in the history of relations between Ukraine and the Holy See but also in the history of Ukrainian diplomacy as a whole, as it was the first time a woman was appointed as an ambassador to such a specific place
The embassy consisted only of her and a driver, and the entire mission operated from a single room - an incredibly modest setup. Overall, I believe that our women in diplomatic positions are people with «thirty hands and thirty heads» in the best sense: they know and can do everything. Nina Kovalska exemplified this vividly: she gave interviews, hosted students, organised the first Ukrainian-Italian conference, and made maximum efforts to prepare for Pope John Paul II's visit to Ukraine despite Russian opposition. Her work was recognised both by Ukraine and the Holy See, earning her distinctions. Nina Kovalska left the Vatican at the end of her tenure with the Grand Cross of the Order of Pius IX.
After her, another extraordinary woman, Tetyana Izhevska, was appointed ambassador to the Holy See and the first ambassador of Ukraine to the Sovereign Military Order of Malta. She served there for almost 13 years. It was Tetyana Izhevska who was called a star of diplomacy by her Polish colleague.
- Has the presence of women in diplomatic service and missions influenced the quality of diplomatic service and negotiation processes?
- This seems to be a stereotype. We have debated this topic extensively, which is why we consciously chose the term «women in diplomacy» rather than «women’s diplomacy». In our concept, the notion of «women in diplomacy» encompasses career diplomats, diplomats’ wives and leaders in the field of public diplomacy. Most successful women in ambassadorial roles respond to this question in the same way: there is no such thing as «women’s» or «men’s» diplomacy - only professionalism and a calling. To be effective in diplomacy, one must always remember the well-known three keys to diplomacy of Hennadiy Udovenko: the first is professionalism, followed by patriotism and integrity.
These qualities are not dependent on gender but on the level of education, the ability to apply knowledge in practice and self-control. Psychological resilience, language skills, negotiation ability and other factors also play a crucial role. Female diplomats emphasise that a woman’s smile is not a key argument in negotiations. The defining factor is professionalism.
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Head of «Women's Territory» Liliia Shevchenko: «We give women a sense of sisterhood»
Nataliia Zhukovska
«Women's Territory» is a nationwide organisation that has united women worldwide. Over nearly 11 years of existence, they have implemented dozens of projects, including cultural ones. The head of the organisation, Liliia Shevchenko, believes that a person who knows their roots automatically understands who they are and what they must do to preserve their country. The full-scale war has altered the organisation's operations. They have already delivered over five hundred tonnes of humanitarian aid to military personnel and civilians. They support families of prisoners of war and help women who have experienced violence. Moreover, they are expanding their presence in Europe.
Nataliia Zhukovska: Ms Liliia, you are the head of the «Women's Territory» organisation. What is this territory like?
Liliia Shevchenko: Our nationwide public organisation «Women's Territory» was founded by ideologically driven women who live and breathe Ukraine. This is not an empty phrase but the pure truth. «Women's Territory» is neither defined nor limited by borders. It is not only the territory of those residing in Ukraine but also the territory of women worldwide, especially now, when millions of Ukrainian women, fleeing war, have found temporary refuge in many European countries. We want to help them systematically. So, we decided that «Women's Territory» would now operate under the umbrella of the host country and its laws. Currently, work on the documents for «Women's Territory» in Poland is nearing completion. We have held talks with representatives from the Polish Ministry of Social Policy and with relocated Ukrainian businesses and Polish businesses. How will they help Ukrainian women in Poland? Primarily by organising Sunday schools. This is important so that children while learning about the culture of their host country, do not forget their Ukrainian heritage. Given that Ukraine is in a full-scale war and most funds from businesses and ministries are allocated to military needs, there is insufficient funding from the Ministry of Education for books and educational materials for children abroad. One of the tasks of «Women's Territory» is not only to establish Sunday schools but also to print books. We have already held talks with the «Gutenberg» publishing house. We will distribute books for free, starting with our Sunday schools.
We already have a developed base, so organising work in Poland will not be difficult. One of our members opened the first art school in Warsaw at the end of 2022 and has already received small grants from the local Polish authorities. The school offers free art classes to both Ukrainian and Polish children.
One of the messages of «Women's Territory» is that we not only take from the countries that shelter us but also give to them
We have provided Europe with qualified specialists. Due to the war in Ukraine, many educators, medical professionals and managers moved to the EU. Many of them have already had their diplomas recognised. For instance, our member, who led «Women's Territory» in Dnipro, now lives in Gdansk, has confirmed her qualifications, and is a qualified lawyer. Her mother also verified her diploma and works as a dentist. So, we offer our knowledge and services to the Polish people as well. We want the Poles to understand that they do not only give but also receive. This will also be one of the tasks of «Women's Territory» in Poland.
We will also focus on women's leadership and gender issues. A woman must understand her status and significance in society.
How has the organisation's work changed since the start of the full-scale war?
«Women's Territory» shifted 90 per cent towards volunteer activities. In Poland, for example, we partnered with several Polish foundations that had a 400-square-metre volunteer warehouse in Warsaw. We are grateful to the Poles for covering its rental costs for an extended period. It was packed to the ceiling with humanitarian aid, ranging from clothing and food to expensive medical supplies, which we distributed to Ukrainian hospitals. For example, we had diffuser devices, each costing around 2500 euros, with over a thousand in stock. We equipped hospitals with beds, X-ray machines, and vitamins. Both Ukrainians and Poles worked at the warehouse. We dispatched trucks loaded with aid based on recipients' requests and provided support to relocated family-type children's homes and care facilities for the elderly. We received tourniquets and body armour and raised funds for drones. We did not merely adapt to new challenges - we also helped others adapt to them.
Who are the members of your organisation?
There are around two thousand of us. There are women, heads of departments, who have their own public organisations and foundations. For example, our member is Iryna Mikhniuk - a widow, the wife of a fallen Hero of Ukraine. Since 2014, she has headed the organisation «Wings of the Eighth Hundred» - it consists of widows, wives of the fallen, and children. In Ukraine, there are already 19 officially registered branches of ours. The team includes women from various professions and financial backgrounds, but with a shared ideological mindset and vision. There are also military personnel, such as Viktoria Khrystenko, who was the first adviser to the Admiral of the Ukrainian Navy.
In my team, there is a board member of «Women's Territory» from Donetsk, Alina Khaletska, who was forced to flee her native city. Her family had a unique background. Her husband worked for the Donetsk administration, and she herself is a lecturer, professor and academician. They left everything behind when they fled. Upon arriving in Irpin, they worked hard to save money and eventually started purchasing a flat. Sadly, during the full-scale war, it was destroyed by an enemy shell. They endured the occupation in Irpin. In other words, they have lived through occupation twice in their lifetime. This woman was offered work abroad. Where do you think she is? In Irpin. She does not wish to leave Ukraine.
What problems do women approach you with?
Many women joined us when we became part of the coalition «Women, Peace, Security». These are activists fighting for women's leadership and supporting victims of violence. In Ukraine, this remains a major issue, especially in places like Bucha and Irpin. You are likely familiar with some of these stories. There is much I know but cannot share publicly. Our agreement is to not speak of experiences unless we were participants. I am a witness. These are stories lived by women, girls, or children. They share their stories themselves if they wish to. All stories are heavy. How do we support them? I always advocate for mutual assistance and supporting one another. It is crucial to speak with them very carefully, as every word can be traumatising.
We help them regain their footing, providing a sense of sisterhood and the reassurance that they are not alone - that we stand together
We stress that anyone could find themselves in a similar situation. Our message is one of solidarity. Sometimes, we involve these women in processes by seeking their help to show them they are needed. Engagement, even minimal, can serve as a distraction and relief. We have no formal programme for this, our approach has been refined over many years.
Additionally, through a memorandum of cooperation with municipal employment centres, we assist women in retraining and finding jobs. We collaborate closely with the Ministry of Veterans. Many of the women in «Women's Territory» are defenders who were once civilians. We were the first to help sew military uniforms and undergarments for women. We also sourced anatomical body armour specifically designed for them.
What has the organisation accomplished during its existence?
Our lives are now divided into «before» and «after» the full-scale war. Prior to it, we had a powerful project that united Ukrainian children living abroad. We also established the International Festival of Cultural and Creative Industries, known as «Women's Territory», which we later renamed «Masters' Territory». If not for the full-scale war, this festival would have received funding from the Ministry of Culture and Information Policy. It was a platform that elevated Ukrainian crafts, demonstrating that Ukrainian products are not merely sold at fairs and markets, but even in five-star hotels. For now, this project has been put on hold. Today, we focus on uniting Ukrainian women abroad.
We strive to ensure that Ukraine is not forgotten. Our initial focus is on registering «Women's Territory» in Poland and France. Next, we plan for Belgium, Switzerland, Germany and Spain
We have provided female defenders with over 1200 boxes containing first-aid kits, vitamins, special olive-based creams to prevent skin cracking and even perfumes.
Every woman should feel like a woman, no matter where she is. We even provided hair dye tailored to their colour types. Once, I asked the women to take photos for a media campaign to raise funds for these boxes. They sent back pictures - clean, with hairstyles and manicures. It turned out they had travelled to a district centre and, using their own money, found skilled manicure artists and hairdressers. They told me, «Lilia, when we opened these boxes, we felt like we were at home». You see, they received a psychological breath of happiness.
Your organisation has helped women with children evacuate from dangerous areas to avoid occupation. How did this happen, and how many people have you assisted?
We do not have exact numbers on how many people we have helped. We evacuated people from Melitopol, Berdyansk, Kherson, Donetsk region, and the left, already occupied, bank of the Zaporizhzhia region. Of course, we were assisted by the military. I am unsure if I am allowed to disclose the details of every rescue story. I will share one - the story of a mother with two children who were leaving Melitopol. At that time, her daughter was 15, and her son was three years old. Their father was in the Armed Forces of Ukraine. If the Russians had found this out, they would have been executed. She instructed her children to remain silent and, if necessary, to respond only in Russian. On their way, Russian soldiers armed with weapons boarded the bus to conduct checks. Approaching them, the muzzle of a rifle hanging on one soldier's shoulder accidentally pressed against the child's head. The boy was so terrified that he wets himself to this day. They were interrogated, their phone SIM cards were examined, and the family endured multiple rounds of hell. It later turned out they were fortunate that the child was not undressed. Only later did the mother notice a hidden sheet of A4 paper on her son's chest. On it was a drawing of his father in military uniform, with a flag and the words «Glory to Ukraine!». The boy had placed that drawing there himself. To him, it represented Ukraine, his life. If the Russians had seen that drawing, they would have been executed. We have many such stories.
Do you keep in touch with the families you have assisted?
Someday, I will revisit those lists. But for now, our priority is to officially establish «Women's Territory» in Europe and America. We are resilient, genuine, and active. We are women accustomed to giving, not taking. Perhaps in time, I will become more interested in the fates of those we have helped. However, I often question whether reaching out would be beneficial or if it might unintentionally bring harm.
You travel abroad frequently. What do you talk about there, how do foreigners react, and what interests them most?
I talk about the solidarity and resilience of the Ukrainian people. I share the harsh realities of war we face, the immense challenges, and our efforts to overcome them. My message is always framed to emphasise the need for support in these efforts. I say, «We are taking action, not standing by. Help us in this war in any way you can - through expertise, humanitarian aid, or military support». We consistently highlight the need to support the Ukrainian army, and I know our message is being heard.
«Women's Territory» supports prisoners of war and continuously participates in various campaigns. Do you believe these efforts contribute to exchanges?
Absolutely. We have been supporting the families of prisoners of war since the start of the war in 2014. We organise events with the mothers, wives, and children of captured marines. Do you remember those taken prisoner in Crimea at the beginning of the war? We brought the mother and daughter of one of the marines to the UN so that their speech could raise awareness and tell the truth about the war in Ukraine. Any information campaign must be planned and ongoing. Such initiatives not only ensure that the world does not forget those in captivity but also help the relatives of prisoners of war feel they are not alone, preventing them from being lost in their grief. Tragedy unites. We have many poignant stories related to the return of prisoners of war. Recently, there was a soldier on the list who had been eagerly awaited by everyone. They thought he had come back. However, it turned out it was not him. The surname was the same, but the first name was different.
You also conduct training sessions for government institutions on communication with veterans and their families. What are the key principles you focus on?
I will illustrate with the example of the Kyiv City Employment Centre. Engaging with a military veteran, a defender or a servicewoman, requires a particular approach. For instance, we - as empaths - often feel the urge to approach a soldier on the street and say, «Thank you for your service. Glory to Ukraine». We might want to hug them and say, «You are a hero!». Yet, almost none of this should be said or done. These are triggers. If you call them heroes, they often do not perceive themselves that way. This is why we educate not only employees of state institutions but also the civilian population. The most important thing is teaching how to understand and engage with these individuals. For example, when they come to the Kyiv City Employment Centre, the manager who interacts with them must be highly qualified and aware that every soldier might experience flashbacks. We train them to pay attention to facial expressions, eyes, and behaviour. Employees of such institutions must be prepared for any possible scenario because almost all soldiers have experienced concussions. Furthermore, there must be barrier-free access and inclusivity.
Veterans must be actively involved in rebuilding Ukraine after the war, not left idle at home
Sociologists warn of a crisis facing the country after the war, particularly a demographic one. Do you think Ukrainian women will return from Europe after the victory? What steps are needed to ensure this?
I am unsure if I can speak openly about this, but yes, we are facing a demographic crisis. A baby boom will not be enough to solve this. We are exploring solutions because it concerns our future. Will women return from abroad? The longer the full-scale war continues, the less likely it becomes. Many divorces are happening now. Numerous women have adapted to their children's needs, and most of these children are assimilating into the societies where they now live. We have already encountered such cases among my members. They lived abroad. The daughter wanted to return, but the son did not. He had adapted, made friends, and was better accepted in his class than he had been at home. He likes the new country.
We must understand that parents' decisions will be influenced by their children. Therefore, we need to prioritise working with children abroad
Moreover, many women abroad have managed to realise themselves better or earn more than they did at home. For example, she was a nurse in a hospital in western Ukraine, and now she works as a nurse in Wroclaw. In Poland, she earns significantly more. Our officials must listen to society and start developing a programme to bring Ukrainian women home today. «Women's Territory» will undoubtedly contribute to this effort, primarily with its experience and resources. After all, we live in this country - to defend, revive, and provide it with a future. Fortunately, the majority of «Women's Territory» members abroad understand this.
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«Ukraine increasingly resembles Israel - living under constant threat and getting used to the war», - Michał Bilewicz
Olga Pakosh
Traumatised by uncertainty
Olga Pakosh: How traumatised is contemporary Ukrainian society? How would you characterise it?
Michał Bilewicz: We cannot say that the entire society suffers from PTSD. If that were the case, people would likely struggle to function normally. Let me remind you that PTSD symptoms include persistent flashbacks, intrusive thoughts about war and the inability to concentrate on anything else. Meanwhile, we see that the Ukrainian state is functioning - the economy is operating, and daily life goes on.
Ukraine increasingly resembles Israel - a society living under constant threat.
Israeli psychologist Daniel Bar-Tal described this phenomenon as an «intractable conflict», where society adapts to continuous conflict, accepting it as a natural state of affairs. He also wrote about the «ethos of conflict», referring to how societies grow accustomed to living in a state of war.
What does this look like in Israel? When I visited, I was always struck by the fact that every flat has a safe room that doubles as a bomb shelter. Residents go to this room whenever an alarm sounds. After all, the advanced Iron Dome missile defence system is not entirely foolproof - missiles occasionally hit homes.
It seems that Israeli society has adapted to living with war. On the one hand, it functions normally, but on the other, conflict is a constant presence. We are not only talking about the war in Gaza but about a phenomenon that, with some interruptions, has persisted throughout modern Israeli history. As Bar-Tal points out, this situation erodes social trust and influences attitudes towards international politics - people are reluctant to seek alliances and agreements with other nations, feeling that the world is hostile and untrustworthy.
For Ukraine, the key objective is to join European structures - the European Union and NATO - as quickly as possible. This could ensure Ukraine’s future security and stable economic functioning. However, for this to work, it is essential to avoid slipping into the mentality typical of societies accustomed to war.
Since 2014, Ukraine has been in a constant state of war, with varying levels of intensity, and this is extremely dangerous. Therefore, I would describe Ukrainian society as one that is, to some extent, adapting to life in wartime conditions.
- The war in Ukraine has opened up vast areas for research in social and clinical psychology. No doubt you have been following these studies. Have you encountered anything surprising? Have you conducted joint studies with Ukrainian institutions?
- We have conducted two studies. Together with Anna Hromova, a PhD candidate from the Institute of Social and Political Psychology at the National Academy of Pedagogical Sciences of Ukraine, we examined almost five thousand Ukrainian refugees living in Poland to study the prevalence of post-traumatic stress disorder (PTSD) and the degree of trauma. We also looked into how living conditions in Poland affect the development of PTSD symptoms and reflected on whether post-migration experiences might intensify trauma, and if so, in what ways.
As you may recall from the book, I was surprised by the findings of previous research, which showed that PTSD rates in Poland ranged from 20 to 30 per cent. For example, in studies conducted in Silesia after the floods, 30 per cent of the population exhibited PTSD symptoms. Even among students who visited the Auschwitz museum, 15 per cent were diagnosed with PTSD. These numbers have always been exceptionally high.
In our study of Ukrainian refugee women in Poland, we found a PTSD rate of 47 per cent. I must say, I have never seen such a result in my life. This is indeed a very high level of trauma
It is a consequence not only of the traumatic wartime experiences but also of the conditions in which the refugees find themselves after migrating.
- Could you explain why the level of trauma is so high?
- Typically, PTSD studies are conducted after a conflict ends, when peace returns. In our study, we dealt with an ongoing war, where the women surveyed continue to live in a state of uncertainty. Their husbands are often on the front lines or at risk of being called up, which adds to the stress.
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The vast majority of these women face acculturation challenges (the process of mutual cultural influence, where one culture adopts aspects of another - Edit.) in the new society. Acculturation-related stress, including experiences or fears of discrimination in Poland, leads to more intense PTSD symptoms. It is harder for people to move past war trauma when they encounter discrimination in the country they have moved to. Therefore, it is crucial that Poland creates the most supportive environment possible for Ukrainian refugees, as this directly impacts their mental health and their ability to function well in Poland.
Of course, the intensity of PTSD symptoms also depends on individual characteristics. We noticed that people who struggle with uncertainty managed the worst. We remember how things were in the spring of 2022 - full of uncertainty and chaos. People with low tolerance for uncertainty were more prone to PTSD, whereas those who coped better with such situations were less likely to experience symptoms.
«During war trust in the government is essential»
- You mentioned two studies. What was the focus of the second one?
- The second study, which we conducted in collaboration with Ukrainians, was focused on Ukraine itself and examined how complex PTSD experiences influence various forms of distrust and conspiracy theories. I have been interested for some time in how these traumas can shape such attitudes. I observe this phenomenon in Poland as well:
Historical traumas cause people, even generations later, to continue viewing their surroundings as unreliable and to seek out conspiracy theories
It seems that something similar is happening in Ukraine. When I speak with Ukrainians, I often hear conspiracy theories about President Zelensky - for instance, that there are Russian agents among his close associates. This reflects a certain level of fundamental distrust towards politicians, which, in wartime, is very dangerous. The greater the social cohesion and trust in the authorities, the better it is for the country. Even if the authorities do not always act perfectly - and with issues like corruption in our part of Europe, we know this is sometimes the case - in a war situation, trust in the government is essential.
A similar issue relates to trust in science. We studied this in Ukraine, focusing on how much people trust health and medical services, particularly regarding vaccination. We found that people with stronger PTSD symptoms tend to have less trust in science. We are not yet certain in which direction this correlation moves - this is preliminary research - but we are interested in whether war experiences and trauma impact overall distrust or if people simply lose trust in various areas of life. This is a quite dangerous phenomenon, and it often arises in wartime conditions.
- How can this trust be restored? What could help Ukrainians to endure and maintain mental stability until victory?
- Certainly, restoring a sense of agency in daily life - the awareness that what one does has meaning, that one can plan something and carry it out.
The more people feel capable, the better they will function. This is why combating corruption is so essential, as it robs people of the feeling that they have any control over their lives. They know that everything is decided for them, and they have no influence. Effective anti-corruption measures can significantly improve the mental health of society.
- Unfortunately, war poses a massive threat to that sense of agency, doesn’t it?
- War complicates this greatly, which is why it is important for people to be able to say, «Even if war hinders certain plans, at least in other areas of life, nothing can stand in my way». It is crucial to help people regain this sense, as war fundamentally destroys it, stripping away their feeling of control. It is vital that people can maintain control and agency in their daily lives.
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«Poland has no right to write Ukraine’s history»
- How do you think Poles' attitudes towards Ukrainians have changed since the start of the war? How do Poles perceive Ukrainians now?
- In my book, I try to counter a fatalistic outlook, as Poles tend to complain about themselves. I think Ukrainians do the same. We do not criticise ourselves when speaking with Germans or French people, but among ourselves, we often criticise one another.
Poles tend to think of themselves as biased, inhospitable, full of stereotypes. However, what we saw in the spring of 2022 was entirely different - a huge societal mobilisation to help Ukraine. People were sending money to buy weapons, purchasing food, and bringing people from the border. One in every twenty Poles welcomed Ukrainians into their homes. These were unprecedented actions.
I do not know of any other European society that has carried out such a large-scale relief effort, organised not by the government but by ordinary citizens
Of course, this was also supported by the strong networks among Ukrainians already living in Poland. It is important to remember that there were already a million Ukrainians residing in Poland at the time, who supported their relatives and friends. This was one of the key elements that made this large-scale aid possible.
At the same time, our research indicated not only significant sympathy but also strong support for aiding Ukraine, particularly in the acceptance of refugees. This was interesting, as Poles are generally not particularly supportive of refugees. Ukrainian citizens benefitted from the fact that Poles already had experience interacting with them. When we ask Poles whether they personally know any Arabs, 80 to 90 per cent respond that they have never encountered any in their lives. A similar situation applies to Romani people, with around 80 per cent of Poles reporting they have never had contact with them. When asked about Jews, 90 per cent of Poles claim they do not personally know any. However, the responses to questions about Ukrainians yield different results: even before the war, around half of Poles personally knew some Ukrainians.
A large number of Ukrainians, particularly from Western Ukraine, have been coming to Poland for years to work. Following 2014, Ukrainians from eastern regions, including Russian-speaking individuals, also began arriving in Poland. Poles became acquainted with them and observed that they were very similar to themselves. These relationships were not superficial - they were not just with Ukrainian workers in shops, but also with colleagues, and with parents of children attending the same schools as Polish children. This prepared Poles for 2022, as these refugees were no longer strangers - they were people whom Poles knew and had relationships with.
I believe that if the situation were reversed, and war broke out in Poland, Ukrainians would similarly take in Poles. Polish-Ukrainian relations are strong and mutually supportive.
It should also be noted that, before the war, there was considerable hatred directed at Ukrainians on the internet, particularly concerning the Volyn tragedy and war crimes. However, following 2022, this topic has almost vanished. Unfortunately, it is now gradually resurfacing, although these past two years have allowed us to step back from this issue.
In terms of Poles’ attitudes towards Ukrainians, enthusiasm for assistance has somewhat declined, yet the majority of Poles still believe that Ukrainian refugees should be supported and that Poland must continue backing Ukraine in the ongoing conflict. Well over half of Poles hold this view, so it cannot be said that Polish society has turned away from Ukraine and its people. We are still a long way from that.
- This is good news. However, the subject of Volyn has resurfaced, this time through the voice of the Prime Minister. Donald Tusk stated that until all details surrounding the Volyn tragedy are clarified and exhumations conducted, Poland will not support Ukraine’s path to the European Union...
- I believe this was a reaction to certain events. After Dmytro Kuleba ceased to be minister, the issue somewhat subsided. It was indeed an unfortunate comment. On one hand, I believe that Minister Kuleba spoke the truth, but as a diplomat, he ought not to have said it at that moment and in response to such a question. However, the time will come when Poles will need to raise the issue of Operation «Vistula» and earnestly confront it.
Of course, it can be argued that the actions were those of the communists, not the Polish people, that it was the communist government of a state that no longer exists. However, it is essential to remember the complex interwar politics of Poland, which discriminated against Ukrainians. I know this well, as I myself come from Ukraine. My grandmother was from Kolomyia, and my grandfather from Ivano-Frankivsk, so I am aware of what happened there before the war and of Poland’s discriminatory policies towards Ukrainians.
- How can the issue of the Volyn tragedy be resolved on both historical and political levels so that it is no longer a burden on Polish-Ukrainian relations? You summarised it well in your book: «to talk about history, but not live in it».
- Vadym Vasyutynsky of the Institute of Social and Political Psychology at the National Academy of Pedagogical Sciences of Ukraine conducted an interesting study, which he began before the full-scale war and continued afterwards. As far as I recall, he asked Ukrainians, in a large sample, whether Ukrainians caused more harm or good to Poles throughout their shared history.
After 2022, the number of people acknowledging that there were also negative events, including crimes, in these relations increased. This indicates that Ukrainians are becoming more open to discussing challenging moments in their shared history with Poles.
I pondered over why this might be. Perhaps, after 2022, Ukrainians realised just how important good relations with Poland and the West are? Politically, we see that, for example, former President Viktor Yushchenko referred to the traditions of the UPA, even highlighting some of the more controversial aspects of history, including the forces that collaborated with the Germans during the war. In contrast, Volodymyr Zelensky tends to avoid this. It seems to me that there has been a noticeable shift from Yushchenko to Zelensky in terms of which aspects of history are suitable and necessary to highlight, such as the Carpathian Sich…
- Am I correct in understanding that you suggest celebrating other stages of Ukrainian history, rather than those that may be painful for Poland?
- Exactly. When considering our history, one can always choose different elements to promote and to build one’s identity upon. Some elements damage our relations - both Polish and Ukrainian ones. If Poles were to build their identity on the history of Jeremi Wiśniowiecki, who killed Cossacks, it would not be beneficial for relations with Ukraine, would it?
I believe there are excellent periods in our history worth highlighting. For instance, Ivan Franko, or figures like Petliura, who, despite mixed views among Ukrainians, is well-regarded by Poles.
Of course, Poland does not have the right to write Ukraine’s history. Please do not ask me about this, as it is a question for Ukrainians. Likewise, Ukrainians do not have the right to write Poland’s history.
However, I can express my dissatisfaction when Poles avoid taking a clear stance on Operation «Vistula» and fail to say: «Yes, a terrible wrong was committed, with masses of people forcibly relocated, deprived of land on which they had lived for generations.» It was wrong, just like the pacification of Ukrainian villages before the war, the destruction of the «Maslosoyuz» cooperative and Ukrainian cooperatives, and the imprisonment and torture of Ukrainian politicians by the authorities of the Second Polish Republic. Poland needs to acknowledge this, to learn to speak about it, and to engage in dialogue with Ukrainians.
As for Ukraine, this is a matter for Ukrainian historians - how they propose to present their history. My ideal scenario would be what Poland eventually achieved with Germany after many years: the creation of a joint commission to prepare textbooks.
Historians and educators, both Polish and Ukrainian, could collaborate on a joint textbook to teach Polish-Ukrainian history. This would be incredibly valuable, even if the textbook did not become the primary one used in all schools
It is essential to create spaces where we can collectively discuss how to present this history. It is not about idealising everything but rather about speaking openly, even about the difficult moments. However, it is also important to remember that the situation was asymmetrical: Poland was a coloniser, while Ukraine was a colonised country. This is not a matter of equal responsibility on both sides.
Understanding this context allows for a deeper comprehension of how the events in Volyn occurred. It is also necessary to conduct exhumations and to openly acknowledge that what happened was horrific and should never have taken place.
- It appears there is much work ahead to achieve understanding between Poles and Ukrainians, but with Russians… Is there even a possibility of ever reaching an understanding with them? How do you view this from the perspective of social psychology? Will we ever be able to forgive?
- When we attempt to reconcile nations that have experienced brutal wars, we typically start with moral exemplars. We try to show that even in dark times, people can act morally. For instance, we tell the story of a Russian schoolgirl who had the courage to protest against the war. We are not speaking about an adult, but a young person who not only faces persecution herself but whose entire family suffers as a result of her protest. Such individual acts of defiance demonstrate that even within Russia, one can find people with moral convictions.
This is reminiscent of the situation with Germany after the Second World War. Reconciliation with Germany was made possible because we recognised that, despite much of society supporting Hitler, there were Germans who were persecuted and imprisoned in concentration camps, such as Buchenwald. These were Germans who wished to appeal to a different history. I believe similar individuals can be found in Russia. However, the problem is that, at present, Russia is a country where, on the one hand, the war enjoys substantial support, and on the other, no opinion polls or surveys can be trusted, as people are intimidated.
It resembles living in a state run by a gang
- How much time will need to pass before this topic can be approached?
- Let’s discuss this once the war is over. I think, at this moment, no one in Ukraine wants to hear about it or hear the Russian language - this is entirely understandable, and Ukrainians have an absolute right to feel this way. It depends on the situation and on what Russia looks like post-war. The key will be whether Russians can rebuild their state on a different foundation and set of principles.
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September 2024 in Ukraine in photos
Beata Łyżwa-Sokół
The first day of school for Ukrainian schoolchildren — September 2 — began to the accompaniment of Russian rockets. Instead of sweet sleep in their beds, the children were forced to flee to the bomb shelters, where they tried to get at least a little more sleep. But the enemy did not stop the attack, firing more than a dozen cruise missiles and about a dozen ballistic missiles at Kyiv alone. And in two days, the most tragic event in Lviv happened - during the attack, a whole family died - a mother and three daughters. But, despite this, Ukraine continues to live. Indomitable Ukrainians demonstrate their strength and power in dances, at exhibitions, on catwalks. Because the Russian enemy is unable to do one thing - break the spirit of Ukrainians.
Text: Natalya Ryaba
On September 7, demonstrators staged a protest in Prague, holding blue and yellow umbrellas. The participants of the rally called for effective air defense for Ukraine and to give it the opportunity to strike back. Demonstrators created a "map" of Ukraine using blue and yellow umbrellas.
Students of the International Academy of Personnel Management watch as rescuers put out a fire in one of the buildings of the university after a rocket attack on Kyiv on September 2, 2024. While hiding in the bomb shelter, the students heard the whistling of rockets and explosions.
Ukrainian military medics render aid to a wounded Ukrainian soldier at a stabilization point in the Chasiv Yar region on September 6, 2024.
A Ukrainian servicewoman talks on the phone with her children. On September 13, Russia and Ukraine conducted another exchange of prisoners. 49 Ukrainians returned home — 23 women and 26 men. For the first time in a long time, it was possible to return the "Azovs" to Ukraine. The United Arab Emirates helped organize the exchange.
Ukrainian schoolchildren sing the national anthem during the ceremony for the beginning of the new academic year in Lviv, September 2, 2024.
September 4 became the most tragic for Lviv during the entire war. A mother and her three daughters were killed in the attack. Only the father remained alive. The whole city came to the funeral of the dead. As a result of shelling in Lviv, seven people died, 66 were injured. Also, 188 buildings were damaged, including 19 architectural monuments.
A couple looks at posters depicting fallen Ukrainian soldiers of the Azov Brigade at an open-air exhibition in Kyiv on September 23, 2024.
Freya Brown, a dog trainer in the British Army, with her military dog Zac during a training session with Ukrainian army personnel, at a barracks in the East Midlands, U.K., September 10, 2024. Two years after invasion, large areas of Ukraine are covered in landmines and unexploded ordnance, including cluster munitions, and dogs play a key role in keeping soldiers and civilians safe.
Presentation of Veronika Danilova's collection as part of Ukrainian Fashion Week, September 1, 2024. The designer dedicated her collection called "Garden of the Clouds" to her homeland, inspired by memories of a Ukrainian garden and blossoming apple trees.
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Human Stories
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Mariana joined the military service in one of the Marine Corps units back in 2018. There, she met her future husband, a serviceman in the National Guard. In the spring of 2022, Mariana was taken captive - three months into her pregnancy. Despite her condition, the Russians showed no leniency. However, it was her child that helped her persevere then. After all, «a mother cannot surrender».
On September 22nd 2022, Mariana Mamonova, who was then nine months pregnant, was exchanged. This was the same exchange in which Viktor Medvedchuk was returned to Russia. Alongside her, 214 Ukrainian soldiers who defended Mariupol returned home. Three days after her release, Mariana gave birth to a daughter.
Mariana is now 32. She is a mother, a volunteer, a psychotherapist, and the founder of a charitable foundation aimed at helping women who have experienced Russian captivity. She considers helping women who have endured Russian imprisonment her mission.
«In captivity, they threatened to take my child away and send her to an orphanage»
Kseniya Minchuk: Tell us, how did you recover after captivity? What helped you?
Mariana Mamonova: I gave birth immediately after returning from captivity, so I had no time to adjust. When my daughter turned one and I slowly started to resurface, things became emotionally challenging. I lacked the mental resources for healthy motherhood. I realised I needed help and sought out a psychotherapist, whom I am still working with today.
Something always brings you back to what you experienced in captivity.
I had nightmares. I couldn’t sleep. When my daughter woke up at night, we would turn on a nightlight for children. Then, I couldn’t sleep anymore because, in the colony, we always slept with the lights on
In captivity, a person exhausts all their resources to survive. You do not analyse or reflect - you survive. But when you come out, you start to process everything. Many times, I asked myself, how did I survive it all? I must have been born under a lucky star.
Yet, a child loves you unconditionally, and this love motivates you to achieve new things. My child gives me strength when it seems I have none left. You come home from work, wanting to lie down like a stone, but no - you need to play with your daughter. Soon, you realise that in these games, you find restoration.
- How were you treated in captivity?
- At first, I thought I would be exchanged quickly since I was pregnant. But that did not happen. I was very worried that I might be taken to Russian territory, where women convicted of serious crimes serve their sentences. They threatened me with this - they said they would send me there, that I would give birth there, they would take my child from me, I would remain in that colony, and my child would be taken to an orphanage. I was terribly afraid of this. My fear intensified when I was moved to a hospital in Donetsk - it was then that I realised such a scenario was real. A similar incident occurred in Olenivka. A woman wanted to leave Mariupol, but she and her month-old child were detained at a filtration point. She was taken to Olenivka, and her child was sent to an unknown location. Another pregnant woman was taken to Taganrog, she returned no longer pregnant, as she had endured physical torture.
I was concerned that the constant fear and adrenaline I felt would affect my child's health. At the same time, my child helped me stay strong. I could not afford to give up for her sake. «A mother must be strong», I thought then. I would stroke my belly and talk to my daughter.
In captivity, I dreamed a lot. I imagined where I would walk, how I would drink a latte and eat cherry doughnuts, which I craved immensely. I clung to these fantasies
I also mentally made a list of things I needed to do once I returned from captivity. «You must return», I told myself daily.
- Do you have any insights on why some endure captivity while others do not? I mean psychologically.
- A strong inner core is very important. If one has it, one will endure. In captivity, they constantly press on you not only physically but also psychologically. For example, every day they told us that no one needed us, that everyone had forgotten about us, that Ukraine had no plans to exchange us. «If anyone cared about you, you would have been exchanged already», they told us. But an inner voice told me otherwise. That this was all manipulation. That these were the words of people who attacked us, who kill us and destroy the lives of millions. Insatiable, greedy tyrants. How could one listen to them? Could one expect any truth from them? No. But when the same thing is repeated to you daily for 2-3 years, at some point, doubt creeps in - maybe they are right, and I really am of no use to anyone?
The support and empathy of other prisoners helped me. Our shared struggle sustained all of us. Without a sense of humour, one would probably go mad.
Everyone in captivity knew I was pregnant and tried to help me. I made friends there. Eight girls who were recently exchanged come for rehabilitation in Lviv and always want to see me, they ask me to come with my child: «We want to see the baby we helped feed when we were with you in captivity».
They thought I was struggling in the colony. And I thought they were struggling
They looked at me and said: «If Mariana holds on, then we certainly cannot give up». I was their lifeline.
«Above all, those freed from captivity want to be with their loved ones»
- Tell us about your foundation, which you created to help freed female captives. Who do you help, and in what ways?
- I work as a psychotherapist at the rehabilitation centre «Unbreakable» - with people who have endured captivity and those with combat-related injuries. I know many specialists, so assembling a professional team was not difficult. I chose my colleagues as if I were choosing for myself. It is essential that the team is empathetic, reliable, and highly professional.
The aim of our foundation is to help women who have experienced captivity. We support their rehabilitation: mentally, physically and spiritually. This involves working with psychologists, psychotherapists and in groups - to help them feel like women again and lead happy lives. We call this direction Heelme.
We also provide support to the pregnant wives of servicemen, pregnant veterans and pregnant women who have lost their husbands in the war. This project is called Mommy and Baby. We will provide packages for newborn children, which include items for both the child and the mother. Often, when women give birth, gifts are brought for the child, but the mother is forgotten. We have received approximately three thousand requests for these packages.
To receive assistance from our foundation, one must complete a Google form. It is mandatory to have a Combatant’s ID, a marriage certificate (if the help is for a serviceman's wife), or a birth certificate (if the help is for a serviceman’s newborn child).
- What symptoms of the freed individuals do your psychotherapists work with?
- As a psychotherapist, I encounter various symptoms. These include uncontrollable aggression, a constant immersion in past events, and intrusive memories. There are also sleep disorders, memory impairments, and quick exhaustion. A persistent or periodic feeling of tension and anxiety, as well as numbness or lack of emotions.
Quite often, people returning from captivity do not feel joy or satisfaction in life
This manifests either immediately or three to four months after their return. Social alienation often develops, and sometimes even antisocial behaviour. Working with all of this is very challenging but necessary.
- In your opinion, what should be changed in Ukrainian legislation to improve the lives of people who have returned from captivity?
- Many changes are needed. For instance, people who have endured captivity must undergo rehabilitation. However, those who return to service after captivity do not receive rehabilitation.
Commanders who have not experienced captivity do not understand soldiers who have. And this is not only difficult - it is dangerous. Freed individuals absolutely need additional rehabilitation. Because war is a trigger
A significant problem is that people return from captivity only to be placed in quarantine in a hospital, limiting their contact with society. This is yet another trauma. You escape from one captivity, only to find yourself in another.
Above all, those freed from captivity want to see their loved ones. To embrace them, to talk to them, to realise they are loved, that people fought for them and waited. This gives an inner strength, confirming that it was not in vain to hold on. Only after spending time with family should they be sent for rehabilitation. Unfortunately, freed prisoners are usually confined in hospitals immediately, and then intelligence services arrive for interrogations. Such a procedure never has a positive effect on a person.
Enduring captivity is a lifelong experience. It never truly ends. The effects remain forever. It is impossible to heal in one go. You have to learn to live with it. Thus, rehabilitation for those who have survived captivity is essential. It helps them return to normal life, and for a soldier, it enables effectiveness.
«At least 400 Ukrainian women are in Russian captivity»
- Helping women who return from captivity is a tremendous responsibility. But I am not afraid of this responsibility. I understand these women because I am one of them. I want to give them what I could not receive.
When the euphoria of return fades, daily life begins, where there is constantly something to «sort out». And the mental resources and strength for this are lacking
Our foundation is unique in that it truly understands the rehabilitation of women who have experienced captivity. We are currently seeking investors, and ultimately, I aim for autonomy. I hope people will recognise the importance of our initiative. Because we are helping those who have given away the most valuable thing - their freedom to defend Ukraine.
These people endured 14 out of the 16 types of torture that exist. They are broken people
We must help them become whole again. There are approximately 400 Ukrainian women currently held in Russian captivity. This is an estimate, probably no one knows the exact number.
Many captives die due to torture, and some switch sides under Russian propaganda or threats. Every day we are losing Ukrainians - it is a catastrophe. I wish more people and initiatives would join the efforts to exchange captives. I urge everyone to fight for each person. Otherwise, we will lose this war. And we cannot afford to let that happen.
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«The girls in captivity said: If pregnant Mariana holds on, we certainly cannot give up»
«Enduring captivity stays with you for life. It never truly ends, and one must learn to live with it. Thus, rehabilitation for freed prisoners of war is essential. It helps one return to normal life, and for a soldier, it allows them to be effective», Sestry is told by Mariana Mamonova - a military medic who spent six months pregnant in Russian captivity and now assists those who have also endured imprisonment
Kseniya Minchuk
Mariana joined the military service in one of the Marine Corps units back in 2018. There, she met her future husband, a serviceman in the National Guard. In the spring of 2022, Mariana was taken captive - three months into her pregnancy. Despite her condition, the Russians showed no leniency. However, it was her child that helped her persevere then. After all, «a mother cannot surrender».
On September 22nd 2022, Mariana Mamonova, who was then nine months pregnant, was exchanged. This was the same exchange in which Viktor Medvedchuk was returned to Russia. Alongside her, 214 Ukrainian soldiers who defended Mariupol returned home. Three days after her release, Mariana gave birth to a daughter.
Mariana is now 32. She is a mother, a volunteer, a psychotherapist, and the founder of a charitable foundation aimed at helping women who have experienced Russian captivity. She considers helping women who have endured Russian imprisonment her mission.
«In captivity, they threatened to take my child away and send her to an orphanage»
Kseniya Minchuk: Tell us, how did you recover after captivity? What helped you?
Mariana Mamonova: I gave birth immediately after returning from captivity, so I had no time to adjust. When my daughter turned one and I slowly started to resurface, things became emotionally challenging. I lacked the mental resources for healthy motherhood. I realised I needed help and sought out a psychotherapist, whom I am still working with today.
Something always brings you back to what you experienced in captivity.
I had nightmares. I couldn’t sleep. When my daughter woke up at night, we would turn on a nightlight for children. Then, I couldn’t sleep anymore because, in the colony, we always slept with the lights on
In captivity, a person exhausts all their resources to survive. You do not analyse or reflect - you survive. But when you come out, you start to process everything. Many times, I asked myself, how did I survive it all? I must have been born under a lucky star.
Yet, a child loves you unconditionally, and this love motivates you to achieve new things. My child gives me strength when it seems I have none left. You come home from work, wanting to lie down like a stone, but no - you need to play with your daughter. Soon, you realise that in these games, you find restoration.
- How were you treated in captivity?
- At first, I thought I would be exchanged quickly since I was pregnant. But that did not happen. I was very worried that I might be taken to Russian territory, where women convicted of serious crimes serve their sentences. They threatened me with this - they said they would send me there, that I would give birth there, they would take my child from me, I would remain in that colony, and my child would be taken to an orphanage. I was terribly afraid of this. My fear intensified when I was moved to a hospital in Donetsk - it was then that I realised such a scenario was real. A similar incident occurred in Olenivka. A woman wanted to leave Mariupol, but she and her month-old child were detained at a filtration point. She was taken to Olenivka, and her child was sent to an unknown location. Another pregnant woman was taken to Taganrog, she returned no longer pregnant, as she had endured physical torture.
I was concerned that the constant fear and adrenaline I felt would affect my child's health. At the same time, my child helped me stay strong. I could not afford to give up for her sake. «A mother must be strong», I thought then. I would stroke my belly and talk to my daughter.
In captivity, I dreamed a lot. I imagined where I would walk, how I would drink a latte and eat cherry doughnuts, which I craved immensely. I clung to these fantasies
I also mentally made a list of things I needed to do once I returned from captivity. «You must return», I told myself daily.
- Do you have any insights on why some endure captivity while others do not? I mean psychologically.
- A strong inner core is very important. If one has it, one will endure. In captivity, they constantly press on you not only physically but also psychologically. For example, every day they told us that no one needed us, that everyone had forgotten about us, that Ukraine had no plans to exchange us. «If anyone cared about you, you would have been exchanged already», they told us. But an inner voice told me otherwise. That this was all manipulation. That these were the words of people who attacked us, who kill us and destroy the lives of millions. Insatiable, greedy tyrants. How could one listen to them? Could one expect any truth from them? No. But when the same thing is repeated to you daily for 2-3 years, at some point, doubt creeps in - maybe they are right, and I really am of no use to anyone?
The support and empathy of other prisoners helped me. Our shared struggle sustained all of us. Without a sense of humour, one would probably go mad.
Everyone in captivity knew I was pregnant and tried to help me. I made friends there. Eight girls who were recently exchanged come for rehabilitation in Lviv and always want to see me, they ask me to come with my child: «We want to see the baby we helped feed when we were with you in captivity».
They thought I was struggling in the colony. And I thought they were struggling
They looked at me and said: «If Mariana holds on, then we certainly cannot give up». I was their lifeline.
«Above all, those freed from captivity want to be with their loved ones»
- Tell us about your foundation, which you created to help freed female captives. Who do you help, and in what ways?
- I work as a psychotherapist at the rehabilitation centre «Unbreakable» - with people who have endured captivity and those with combat-related injuries. I know many specialists, so assembling a professional team was not difficult. I chose my colleagues as if I were choosing for myself. It is essential that the team is empathetic, reliable, and highly professional.
The aim of our foundation is to help women who have experienced captivity. We support their rehabilitation: mentally, physically and spiritually. This involves working with psychologists, psychotherapists and in groups - to help them feel like women again and lead happy lives. We call this direction Heelme.
We also provide support to the pregnant wives of servicemen, pregnant veterans and pregnant women who have lost their husbands in the war. This project is called Mommy and Baby. We will provide packages for newborn children, which include items for both the child and the mother. Often, when women give birth, gifts are brought for the child, but the mother is forgotten. We have received approximately three thousand requests for these packages.
To receive assistance from our foundation, one must complete a Google form. It is mandatory to have a Combatant’s ID, a marriage certificate (if the help is for a serviceman's wife), or a birth certificate (if the help is for a serviceman’s newborn child).
- What symptoms of the freed individuals do your psychotherapists work with?
- As a psychotherapist, I encounter various symptoms. These include uncontrollable aggression, a constant immersion in past events, and intrusive memories. There are also sleep disorders, memory impairments, and quick exhaustion. A persistent or periodic feeling of tension and anxiety, as well as numbness or lack of emotions.
Quite often, people returning from captivity do not feel joy or satisfaction in life
This manifests either immediately or three to four months after their return. Social alienation often develops, and sometimes even antisocial behaviour. Working with all of this is very challenging but necessary.
- In your opinion, what should be changed in Ukrainian legislation to improve the lives of people who have returned from captivity?
- Many changes are needed. For instance, people who have endured captivity must undergo rehabilitation. However, those who return to service after captivity do not receive rehabilitation.
Commanders who have not experienced captivity do not understand soldiers who have. And this is not only difficult - it is dangerous. Freed individuals absolutely need additional rehabilitation. Because war is a trigger
A significant problem is that people return from captivity only to be placed in quarantine in a hospital, limiting their contact with society. This is yet another trauma. You escape from one captivity, only to find yourself in another.
Above all, those freed from captivity want to see their loved ones. To embrace them, to talk to them, to realise they are loved, that people fought for them and waited. This gives an inner strength, confirming that it was not in vain to hold on. Only after spending time with family should they be sent for rehabilitation. Unfortunately, freed prisoners are usually confined in hospitals immediately, and then intelligence services arrive for interrogations. Such a procedure never has a positive effect on a person.
Enduring captivity is a lifelong experience. It never truly ends. The effects remain forever. It is impossible to heal in one go. You have to learn to live with it. Thus, rehabilitation for those who have survived captivity is essential. It helps them return to normal life, and for a soldier, it enables effectiveness.
«At least 400 Ukrainian women are in Russian captivity»
- Helping women who return from captivity is a tremendous responsibility. But I am not afraid of this responsibility. I understand these women because I am one of them. I want to give them what I could not receive.
When the euphoria of return fades, daily life begins, where there is constantly something to «sort out». And the mental resources and strength for this are lacking
Our foundation is unique in that it truly understands the rehabilitation of women who have experienced captivity. We are currently seeking investors, and ultimately, I aim for autonomy. I hope people will recognise the importance of our initiative. Because we are helping those who have given away the most valuable thing - their freedom to defend Ukraine.
These people endured 14 out of the 16 types of torture that exist. They are broken people
We must help them become whole again. There are approximately 400 Ukrainian women currently held in Russian captivity. This is an estimate, probably no one knows the exact number.
Many captives die due to torture, and some switch sides under Russian propaganda or threats. Every day we are losing Ukrainians - it is a catastrophe. I wish more people and initiatives would join the efforts to exchange captives. I urge everyone to fight for each person. Otherwise, we will lose this war. And we cannot afford to let that happen.
20
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«The girls in captivity said: If pregnant Mariana holds on, we certainly cannot give up»
Kseniya Minchuk
Volodymyr Nikulin is a policeman from the Main Department of the National Police in the Donetsk region and one of the main figures in the Oscar-winning documentary film «20 Days in Mariupol». He is the very person who enabled Mstyslav Chernov, Evgeniy Maloletka and Vasylysa Stepanenko’s team to escape from Mariupol and transport photo and video evidence of numerous Russian crimes - crossing about 15 checkpoints. In an interview with Sestry, Volodymyr talked about the tricks he used during the evacuation, his collaboration with renowned journalists, and how a packet of biscuits taught him that in life, everything returns: both good and evil.
«It was a blow to me how many of those I knew became traitors»
- I ended up in Mariupol after Donetsk, my home, was captured, - says Volodymyr Nikulin. - I have worked in law enforcement for over 30 years. I worked at the Donetsk Regional Police in 2014 during the epochal events. We were defending the Regional State Administration when there were attempts to seize it. I stayed in Donetsk even when it was almost captured. But in the summer of 2014, my family and I left our home. At that time, it was the only way to continue serving, which is very important to me.
It was especially difficult for me to accept that not all Ukrainian policemen left occupied Donetsk - not all remained loyal to their oath. I knew many of them personally, we served together. And they deliberately chose to become traitors.
Those who stayed in Donetsk switched to the enemy’s side. And those who did not betray ended up in Mariupol.
It is hard to talk about my home in Donetsk. I hope it is still standing. I have already left three homes: in Donetsk, Mariupol, and Myrnohrad. When we left Donetsk, I took nothing with me. I remember my summer mesh shoes, a uniform shirt with short sleeves. I did not even take trousers - I looked for a uniform at the place. But I had loyal comrades and a sense of freedom. Something that was no longer in Donetsk.
In Mariupol, we worked with a reduced team. Out of 120 employees of the regional police department, only 12 remained. When the police force was established, I, as a policeman, went through all the stages of lustration and re-certification. I often travelled to Avdiivka. I was amazed at how people lived there - under shellings. But they lived because there were still the state and freedom. Children played on the playgrounds, shops were open.
My comrade, after being wounded on the frontline, even bought a flat in Avdiivka. That is how much people loved their land and believed in victory
- Did you prepare for the full-scale war?
- In 2021, when we already had information from foreign intelligence that Russia was preparing, we also began our preparations. This helped us a great deal. In 2014, we lost a lot because we were unprepared and could not react quickly. In Mariupol, we did not allow that to happen again. For instance, the Russians did not get hold of any documents or cases when they occupied Mariupol. Nor did they seize any weapons. We had removed everything before the full-scale invasion began. There were also far fewer traitors than in Donetsk. We managed to maintain order as much as possible under such circumstances.
For us, Donetsk policemen, the war did not start in 2022 but in 2014. So, when I was woken at 5 AM on February 24th by my supervisor’s words, «combat alert», I understood everything immediately. It was painful to realise that the entire country was under attack.
«Every morning I prayed: just let the shells miss the building where my family is»
- What do you remember most about the first 20 days in Mariupol?
- I will never forget those days. Later, I will come to terms with them, or perhaps reassess them. But for now, I am still in the midst of the events. Do you hear? We are talking, but at the same time, there are explosions in the background. I am thinking about what to do and where to go after the shelling in Kramatorsk ends. There is no time to think about anything else. But I remember every day and every person who was with me.
The start of the large-scale war stands out in my memory as a creeping feeling of catastrophe. I could feel it in every cell of my body. Then I saw how the city began to be destroyed. The Russians were attacking Mariupol from all sides. We knew they desperately wanted it, but we resisted to avoid repeating Donetsk’s fate.
My wife and daughter decided to stay in Mariupol. My wife said: «I do not want it to be like in Donetsk. I do not want to flee anymore. I want to stay in my own home».
And every morning I would go to work, look at the building where my family remained, and fear that it was the last time I would see it intact
That was the most terrifying thing. Whenever there was shelling and explosions (and they were constant), I would think: «Please, just let it not hit the building where my family is».
As a policeman, I had a lot of work to do. First, I evacuated the documents. Then we gathered weapons, prepared materials for fortifications. And when the assault began, we helped people. The police stayed in the city until the very end. We delivered humanitarian aid, diapers, and found shelter for people. We connected people with doctors. At one point, we were already surrounded in the hospital. Before that, I had brought cookies to this hospital - round ones with fruit filling. And when we were hiding in the basement, the doctors brought us those very same cookies. That is how they came back to me.
- Do you regret staying in Mariupol for so long?
- Actually, I regret leaving. I really did not want to repeat the experience of my native Donetsk. Many people remained in Mariupol. They needed help. Mariupol was surrounded, bombed, and attacked. They did not give the locals a chance to leave the city. Everyone in Mariupol was then living on the edge - between life and death. Bombs from planes, missiles, artillery. Houses were burning down. The Russians deliberately destroyed everything to break the resistance.
They even hit the State Emergency Service (SES) headquarters so that rescuers could not help people. People died horrible deaths. For example, they hid in the basement of a building that was hit by shells, and they were buried under rubble. They could not get out. And there was no one to help - the SES was no longer operational. Doctors, under fire, were pulling people out. Heroes. And there are countless such stories. The number of victims was in the tens and hundreds of thousands. Civilians, children... Buried under rubble in basements. Later, the Russians did not bury the dead but simply took them somewhere.
We cannot even imagine what we will face when we liberate Mariupol…
«We looked at each other and understood - from now on, we would stick together»
- Do you remember how you met Mstyslav Chernov, Evgeniy Maloletka, and Vasylysa Stepanenko?
- We met during horrific events - when the Russians bombed the maternity hospital (March 9th 2022).
- I was impressed by this team. Mariupol was almost destroyed, and only the locals remained in the city. Then, I saw people with the word "Press" on their vests. They were wearing helmets and bulletproof vests. At first, I thought they were foreign journalists. To be honest, I was genuinely glad to see them. It was a somewhat selfish joy, but I am not ashamed because it gave me hope that what was happening to our city might become known to the world. The Russians are skilled at lying, and I was worried that they would conceal their crimes once again.
At first, I met Mstyslav. He said he was from Kharkiv. I asked: «How did you get here? Do you need any help?» He did not answer. We just looked at each other - and I understood that I would help them. Because it was necessary. Not just for them, but for me too. From that moment on, we were together.
The way they worked impressed me. Professional, precise, fearless. One of the most important tasks was sending the recorded materials. It was almost impossible under those conditions. Firstly, they had already become enemies in the eyes of the Russians. Secondly, there were very few places in the city with internet access. At first, we went to the city centre, where there was a Kyivstar base station. In the film, there are scenes of us arriving there, sitting under concrete stairs, while the Russians were bombing, and Mstyslav was sending the footage from his phone. When that location stopped working, we started going to the National Guard and Marine Corps command post, where there was a satellite network. It was a strategic site - policemen in uniform with guns. When we arrived to send the materials, everyone disconnected from the Wi-Fi at my request. They did not even ask questions. Everyone understood the importance of the information, which later influenced many around the world. In part, it contributed to the military aid we received.
«I did not know whether my smashed car would make it anywhere. But I started the engine - and we set off»
- We fought back as best we could. We celebrated every metre we reclaimed. When we managed to retake even one building, it felt like we had liberated the whole city.
On one side of the city, the Russians launched an attack on Mariupol from a hospital. I remember a sniper shot the head nurse in the neck. On the other side of the city, there was a tank assault. In one of the scenes in the film, a Russian tank hides behind a church. Then it came out and started shooting at buildings where people were sheltering.
A tank firing on civilians while hiding behind a church - that is Russia
I remember the eyes of the people who were hiding with us in the hospital. Among them were many elderly people and women, and they looked at us with pleading eyes, asking us to do something to stop them from being killed. I told everyone to stay away from the windows. I knew that if we tried to resist, we would all be shot. The Ukrainian Armed Forces special unit led us out of the encirclement. They saved us.
- When and how did you realise it was time to leave Mariupol?
- Events were unfolding rapidly. The Russians were not creating humanitarian corridors for Mariupol’s residents. On March 14th, people started trying to escape on their own. Security experts advised the journalists - Mstyslav, Evgeniy, and Vasylysa - to leave immediately. They began searching for ways out. I was not planning to leave Mariupol, but by then, we had become one team. Moreover, their first attempt to leave had failed. I felt that I had to stay with them until the end. So, I told them I would drive them out. And my family too.
Evgeniy Maloletka’s car, which the team drove into Mariupol on 24 February, was destroyed. My car had been smashed by «Grad» rockets, and none of the windows were intact. But it still moved. I did not know where it would take us. But I started the engine - and we set off. Now, part of my car is in a museum of journalism in Germany.
We took almost nothing with us. Just a small suitcase for my daughter and wife.
My packed things had been sitting in my flat since 2014 - I had never unpacked them
«My tricks worked because the soldiers at the checkpoints were inexperienced»
- We were travelling without knowing the way. I realised that it was not worth taking the main road. I had worked in criminal investigation, so I knew a few things. We headed towards the coast. But before that, we had to avoid the queue of cars in which others were leaving. There were long columns of vehicles waiting to exit. I knew we had to break through before sunset - only then did we have a chance to get the photos and videos out. So, I decided to shock people and suggested the following.
Mstyslav and Evgeniy, wearing helmets and bulletproof vests marked with Press, were running in front of our car. People saw journalists running, were shocked, did not know what was happening, and made way for us. Then Evgeniy sat on the car’s hood. This was also a way of attracting attention, and people let us through. That is how we made our way through the city. It was a huge risk. But the plan worked.
On the way, we passed through many checkpoints. If the Russians had checked even one of our bags, we would have been captured immediately. We had to ensure they did not search us. So, I acted like a detective. I distracted them. For example, at every checkpoint, I pulled out a pack of Marlboro cigarettes. Right in front of the occupiers, I would light up. This caught their attention. Then I would offer them cigarettes. They got distracted and let us through. This was just a small part of how I handled them. But it worked because the soldiers at the checkpoints were inexperienced. They were easier to deceive. It is frightening to think what could have happened if we had been stopped.
I remember a moment when we were driving in the evening without any lights, crossing the frontline. We turned off the headlights. At any moment, the column of vehicles we were moving with could have been shot at. That is how we passed through Polohy. Later, we reached another checkpoint where we were illuminated by a torch. And then I saw a soldier in a Ukrainian uniform. I got out of the car, approached him, and… hugged him. And he hugged me back. Without a word.
After that, we were stopped by the police, who checked our documents and the car. I was so full of adrenaline that I did not understand anything, but I felt a bit of relief. It is truly a miracle that we managed to escape.
- Do you dream of Mariupol?
- Not yet. I think the brain suppresses memories. Dreams happen when there is time for reflection. And I continue to serve in the Donetsk region. Wherever I am, I will continue to do so. Because this is my land…
Photos and videos from the hero’s private archive.
20
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Ексклюзив
Відео
Фото
Подкаст
«To prevent searches at checkpoints, I acted like a detective», - says policeman from «20 Days in Mariupol»
«We passed through many checkpoints on our way. If Russians had checked even one of our bags, we would have been captured. So, I distracted them. For example, at each of the 15 checkpoints, I pulled out a pack of cigarettes. I would light up in front of the occupiers. This caught their attention. Then I would offer them cigarettes. They got distracted. And they let us pass», - Volodymyr Nikulin, a policeman from the Oscar-winning film
Kseniya Minchuk
Volodymyr Nikulin is a policeman from the Main Department of the National Police in the Donetsk region and one of the main figures in the Oscar-winning documentary film «20 Days in Mariupol». He is the very person who enabled Mstyslav Chernov, Evgeniy Maloletka and Vasylysa Stepanenko’s team to escape from Mariupol and transport photo and video evidence of numerous Russian crimes - crossing about 15 checkpoints. In an interview with Sestry, Volodymyr talked about the tricks he used during the evacuation, his collaboration with renowned journalists, and how a packet of biscuits taught him that in life, everything returns: both good and evil.
«It was a blow to me how many of those I knew became traitors»
- I ended up in Mariupol after Donetsk, my home, was captured, - says Volodymyr Nikulin. - I have worked in law enforcement for over 30 years. I worked at the Donetsk Regional Police in 2014 during the epochal events. We were defending the Regional State Administration when there were attempts to seize it. I stayed in Donetsk even when it was almost captured. But in the summer of 2014, my family and I left our home. At that time, it was the only way to continue serving, which is very important to me.
It was especially difficult for me to accept that not all Ukrainian policemen left occupied Donetsk - not all remained loyal to their oath. I knew many of them personally, we served together. And they deliberately chose to become traitors.
Those who stayed in Donetsk switched to the enemy’s side. And those who did not betray ended up in Mariupol.
It is hard to talk about my home in Donetsk. I hope it is still standing. I have already left three homes: in Donetsk, Mariupol, and Myrnohrad. When we left Donetsk, I took nothing with me. I remember my summer mesh shoes, a uniform shirt with short sleeves. I did not even take trousers - I looked for a uniform at the place. But I had loyal comrades and a sense of freedom. Something that was no longer in Donetsk.
In Mariupol, we worked with a reduced team. Out of 120 employees of the regional police department, only 12 remained. When the police force was established, I, as a policeman, went through all the stages of lustration and re-certification. I often travelled to Avdiivka. I was amazed at how people lived there - under shellings. But they lived because there were still the state and freedom. Children played on the playgrounds, shops were open.
My comrade, after being wounded on the frontline, even bought a flat in Avdiivka. That is how much people loved their land and believed in victory
- Did you prepare for the full-scale war?
- In 2021, when we already had information from foreign intelligence that Russia was preparing, we also began our preparations. This helped us a great deal. In 2014, we lost a lot because we were unprepared and could not react quickly. In Mariupol, we did not allow that to happen again. For instance, the Russians did not get hold of any documents or cases when they occupied Mariupol. Nor did they seize any weapons. We had removed everything before the full-scale invasion began. There were also far fewer traitors than in Donetsk. We managed to maintain order as much as possible under such circumstances.
For us, Donetsk policemen, the war did not start in 2022 but in 2014. So, when I was woken at 5 AM on February 24th by my supervisor’s words, «combat alert», I understood everything immediately. It was painful to realise that the entire country was under attack.
«Every morning I prayed: just let the shells miss the building where my family is»
- What do you remember most about the first 20 days in Mariupol?
- I will never forget those days. Later, I will come to terms with them, or perhaps reassess them. But for now, I am still in the midst of the events. Do you hear? We are talking, but at the same time, there are explosions in the background. I am thinking about what to do and where to go after the shelling in Kramatorsk ends. There is no time to think about anything else. But I remember every day and every person who was with me.
The start of the large-scale war stands out in my memory as a creeping feeling of catastrophe. I could feel it in every cell of my body. Then I saw how the city began to be destroyed. The Russians were attacking Mariupol from all sides. We knew they desperately wanted it, but we resisted to avoid repeating Donetsk’s fate.
My wife and daughter decided to stay in Mariupol. My wife said: «I do not want it to be like in Donetsk. I do not want to flee anymore. I want to stay in my own home».
And every morning I would go to work, look at the building where my family remained, and fear that it was the last time I would see it intact
That was the most terrifying thing. Whenever there was shelling and explosions (and they were constant), I would think: «Please, just let it not hit the building where my family is».
As a policeman, I had a lot of work to do. First, I evacuated the documents. Then we gathered weapons, prepared materials for fortifications. And when the assault began, we helped people. The police stayed in the city until the very end. We delivered humanitarian aid, diapers, and found shelter for people. We connected people with doctors. At one point, we were already surrounded in the hospital. Before that, I had brought cookies to this hospital - round ones with fruit filling. And when we were hiding in the basement, the doctors brought us those very same cookies. That is how they came back to me.
- Do you regret staying in Mariupol for so long?
- Actually, I regret leaving. I really did not want to repeat the experience of my native Donetsk. Many people remained in Mariupol. They needed help. Mariupol was surrounded, bombed, and attacked. They did not give the locals a chance to leave the city. Everyone in Mariupol was then living on the edge - between life and death. Bombs from planes, missiles, artillery. Houses were burning down. The Russians deliberately destroyed everything to break the resistance.
They even hit the State Emergency Service (SES) headquarters so that rescuers could not help people. People died horrible deaths. For example, they hid in the basement of a building that was hit by shells, and they were buried under rubble. They could not get out. And there was no one to help - the SES was no longer operational. Doctors, under fire, were pulling people out. Heroes. And there are countless such stories. The number of victims was in the tens and hundreds of thousands. Civilians, children... Buried under rubble in basements. Later, the Russians did not bury the dead but simply took them somewhere.
We cannot even imagine what we will face when we liberate Mariupol…
«We looked at each other and understood - from now on, we would stick together»
- Do you remember how you met Mstyslav Chernov, Evgeniy Maloletka, and Vasylysa Stepanenko?
- We met during horrific events - when the Russians bombed the maternity hospital (March 9th 2022).
- I was impressed by this team. Mariupol was almost destroyed, and only the locals remained in the city. Then, I saw people with the word "Press" on their vests. They were wearing helmets and bulletproof vests. At first, I thought they were foreign journalists. To be honest, I was genuinely glad to see them. It was a somewhat selfish joy, but I am not ashamed because it gave me hope that what was happening to our city might become known to the world. The Russians are skilled at lying, and I was worried that they would conceal their crimes once again.
At first, I met Mstyslav. He said he was from Kharkiv. I asked: «How did you get here? Do you need any help?» He did not answer. We just looked at each other - and I understood that I would help them. Because it was necessary. Not just for them, but for me too. From that moment on, we were together.
The way they worked impressed me. Professional, precise, fearless. One of the most important tasks was sending the recorded materials. It was almost impossible under those conditions. Firstly, they had already become enemies in the eyes of the Russians. Secondly, there were very few places in the city with internet access. At first, we went to the city centre, where there was a Kyivstar base station. In the film, there are scenes of us arriving there, sitting under concrete stairs, while the Russians were bombing, and Mstyslav was sending the footage from his phone. When that location stopped working, we started going to the National Guard and Marine Corps command post, where there was a satellite network. It was a strategic site - policemen in uniform with guns. When we arrived to send the materials, everyone disconnected from the Wi-Fi at my request. They did not even ask questions. Everyone understood the importance of the information, which later influenced many around the world. In part, it contributed to the military aid we received.
«I did not know whether my smashed car would make it anywhere. But I started the engine - and we set off»
- We fought back as best we could. We celebrated every metre we reclaimed. When we managed to retake even one building, it felt like we had liberated the whole city.
On one side of the city, the Russians launched an attack on Mariupol from a hospital. I remember a sniper shot the head nurse in the neck. On the other side of the city, there was a tank assault. In one of the scenes in the film, a Russian tank hides behind a church. Then it came out and started shooting at buildings where people were sheltering.
A tank firing on civilians while hiding behind a church - that is Russia
I remember the eyes of the people who were hiding with us in the hospital. Among them were many elderly people and women, and they looked at us with pleading eyes, asking us to do something to stop them from being killed. I told everyone to stay away from the windows. I knew that if we tried to resist, we would all be shot. The Ukrainian Armed Forces special unit led us out of the encirclement. They saved us.
- When and how did you realise it was time to leave Mariupol?
- Events were unfolding rapidly. The Russians were not creating humanitarian corridors for Mariupol’s residents. On March 14th, people started trying to escape on their own. Security experts advised the journalists - Mstyslav, Evgeniy, and Vasylysa - to leave immediately. They began searching for ways out. I was not planning to leave Mariupol, but by then, we had become one team. Moreover, their first attempt to leave had failed. I felt that I had to stay with them until the end. So, I told them I would drive them out. And my family too.
Evgeniy Maloletka’s car, which the team drove into Mariupol on 24 February, was destroyed. My car had been smashed by «Grad» rockets, and none of the windows were intact. But it still moved. I did not know where it would take us. But I started the engine - and we set off. Now, part of my car is in a museum of journalism in Germany.
We took almost nothing with us. Just a small suitcase for my daughter and wife.
My packed things had been sitting in my flat since 2014 - I had never unpacked them
«My tricks worked because the soldiers at the checkpoints were inexperienced»
- We were travelling without knowing the way. I realised that it was not worth taking the main road. I had worked in criminal investigation, so I knew a few things. We headed towards the coast. But before that, we had to avoid the queue of cars in which others were leaving. There were long columns of vehicles waiting to exit. I knew we had to break through before sunset - only then did we have a chance to get the photos and videos out. So, I decided to shock people and suggested the following.
Mstyslav and Evgeniy, wearing helmets and bulletproof vests marked with Press, were running in front of our car. People saw journalists running, were shocked, did not know what was happening, and made way for us. Then Evgeniy sat on the car’s hood. This was also a way of attracting attention, and people let us through. That is how we made our way through the city. It was a huge risk. But the plan worked.
On the way, we passed through many checkpoints. If the Russians had checked even one of our bags, we would have been captured immediately. We had to ensure they did not search us. So, I acted like a detective. I distracted them. For example, at every checkpoint, I pulled out a pack of Marlboro cigarettes. Right in front of the occupiers, I would light up. This caught their attention. Then I would offer them cigarettes. They got distracted and let us through. This was just a small part of how I handled them. But it worked because the soldiers at the checkpoints were inexperienced. They were easier to deceive. It is frightening to think what could have happened if we had been stopped.
I remember a moment when we were driving in the evening without any lights, crossing the frontline. We turned off the headlights. At any moment, the column of vehicles we were moving with could have been shot at. That is how we passed through Polohy. Later, we reached another checkpoint where we were illuminated by a torch. And then I saw a soldier in a Ukrainian uniform. I got out of the car, approached him, and… hugged him. And he hugged me back. Without a word.
After that, we were stopped by the police, who checked our documents and the car. I was so full of adrenaline that I did not understand anything, but I felt a bit of relief. It is truly a miracle that we managed to escape.
- Do you dream of Mariupol?
- Not yet. I think the brain suppresses memories. Dreams happen when there is time for reflection. And I continue to serve in the Donetsk region. Wherever I am, I will continue to do so. Because this is my land…
Photos and videos from the hero’s private archive.
Poland has submitted a film about Ukrainians, featuring Ukrainian actors, for the Oscars. The drama «Under the Volcano» by Polish director Damian Kocur explores the transformation of a family from tourists to refugees, due to the full-scale invasion. In this film, which premiered in September at the Toronto International Film Festival, Roman Lutskyi, a well-known actor for Polish audiences, starred. He is known for notable theatrical performances, such as «Hamlet» and «Forefathers' Eve (Dziady)» by Maja Kleczewska. Globally, he gained recognition through his lead role in «Reflection», the first Ukrainian film showcased at the Venice Film Festival. Lutskyi has walked the red carpet at this festival twice, and now, he has an Oscar submission.
«This is my third film about war without combat scenes»
- Damian Kocur once said that we Ukrainians live under a volcano that could erupt at any moment, - said Roman Lutskyi to Sestry. - Under the volcano refers to a neighbouring country, armed to the teeth. In 2014, this «volcano» awakened, and in 2022, it indeed erupted…
- Since «Reflection», you have become a serious dramatic actor. Sometimes, I do not recognise where that cheerful Oleshko Popovich from «The Stronghold» has gone. Your gaze especially has changed. You have also done a drama, «Honeymoon», about a couple's life under occupation, followed by «Under the Volcano» - and everywhere there is war.
- If you have noticed, «Under the Volcano» is already my third war film without combat scenes. People understand what war is like on the front line. But the war within Ukrainian families - Europeans do not see that.
With the onset of the great war, every family had to choose - to stay or to leave. This choice gave birth to numerous conflicts. Even in my family, we argued, deciding what to do next. War provokes micro-wars - within small family universes. It is not just about the combat scenes shown on television.
- And it is precisely about such a war that you tell in each of your films. You are not running on screen with a gun, but you reveal to the world the internal drama Ukrainians go through.
- Yes, this is not action, it is subtler, and that is interesting for me as an actor.
«The director did not want to cast me because of my… «actorly» beard»
- Tell us, how did you end up in the film «Under the Volcano» and why director Damian Kocur chose you for the leading male role?
- Oh, it was quite a story. Kocur, a Polish director, is not very familiar with the Ukrainian acting market, so he asked the casting director to gather a list of Ukrainian actors for him. I was on the list, but the director initially dismissed me. As I later learned, Damian said that Roman Lutskyi was too handsome, with that overly actorly beard, and he wanted regular, ordinary people.
I was unaware of this until a friend asked me to help her record a self-tape, also for Kocur - just to stand behind the camera and argue with her on screen, and we did it. Damian saw the footage and asked who was that person behind the camera arguing so convincingly - saying he wanted the guy behind the camera. I was invited for an interview, and based on that, I was cast in one of the main roles.
- Why did Poland choose to submit the film «Under the Volcano» for the Oscars? It is not about Poles, it is about Ukrainians, and Ukrainians perform in it.
- Perhaps they saw that this particular film is competitive on the international stage and could resonate more strongly than local stories in the context of current events.
It also advocates for Ukraine. We often hear that people are tired of Ukrainians and their war, but it turns out that not everyone feels that way. The world needs to be constantly reminded of this war, and we are grateful to Poland for doing that.
There is only one question: whom should Ukrainians root for at the Oscars now - the Ukrainian film «La Palisade» or the Polish «Under the Volcano»?
In general, this film is for export. We have lived through all of this and understand very well who the enemy is. Meanwhile, the world has not fully grasped the danger of this war. Some still doubt, trying to advocate for the enemy. It is a dangerous game - to wait and not take notice, thinking that Ukraine will protect everyone. The volcano’s effects could be felt by all.
- Your first film about war was «Reflection», before that, you had not acted in such films. Director Valentyn Vasyanovych plunged you into the horrors of war at its very beginning - in 2014. Captivity, torture, PTSD... How difficult was it to act in such a film?
- As an actor, it was an intriguing challenge. It was crucial that Valentyn Vasyanovych, a deep-thinking director, made this film. The subjects of Ukrainian captivity and PTSD are weighty, and it was important to depict them correctly without exaggeration.
Viewers may have felt uncomfortable watching this film, but we know that the tortures shown in the film are experiences that Ukrainians endure in real life. Since 2014, the «Isolation» prison in the DPR territory has been a terrifying place where our people have been tortured in various ways. The worst part was that the captives did not know if they would ever be released.
I played a military surgeon who ended up in this prison. Immersed in the filming process, I lived alone in an apartment and hardly went out. At that time, I watched many videos on the subject and read numerous books. I tried to come close to that heavy and unpleasant state and to remain in it. To avoid «jumping» into it only when in front of the camera and then coming out after the director called «cut».
- Great actors, before playing a role, observe people similar to the characters they will portray. How do you prepare for roles - for instance, when playing a person with PTSD after captivity?
- I spoke at length with psychiatrists and with nurses in rehabilitation clinics.
Doctors told me how people walk after captivity - not straight, but curling up into a sort of «question mark», barely lifting their eyes from the ground
I used this technical detail about a captive’s physiology.
The film’s consultant, Stanislav Aseyev - a journalist and author of the book «The Bright Path. The Story of One Concentration Camp» - told me many things. He was a prisoner in the DPR’s «Isolation» concentration camp for 28 months and described in his book the horrors inflicted on captives there. For example, Aseyev explained in detail what a person feels when subjected to electric shock - I reproduced this in the scene where my character is tortured in this way. He described how the current passes through, which muscles contract, and whether it is possible to scream when the current goes from the ear to the hand, causing spasms in the vocal cords.
- These are very frightening things, but Vasyanovych managed to turn this material into a work of art.
- Yes, everything in Valentyn’s work is very meticulous, dry and without excessive drama. If you noticed, there is no music in «Reflection» because it would only intensify an already terrifying picture.
- You attended the screening of «Reflection» in Venice. How did the European audience respond to the film?
- After the screening, there was prolonged applause. People said that we managed to convey the filth of war through artistic means. This story moved viewers, many people cried. I would add that this film should be watched on a big screen because viewing it on a phone or even a computer does not convey the full range of emotions.
«I learnt Polish from TV by ear»
- Whom would you refuse to portray in films today? Perhaps an evil muscovite?
- Listen, but who should play Muscovites? Should we invite actual Muscovites or what? Many Ukrainian actors are fluent in Russian.
This is a reality because we are a post-colonial country. Just as Lebanese people speak French fluently, or Indians speak English. One actor or another will play a Muscovite. We do not always play likeable characters, that is our lot as actors.
Personally, I do not refuse roles, but I do refuse certain material. If it is superficial or vulgar, flat, and uninteresting, then definitely no. But if the material is deep and relevant, then I would take it on, even if I had to play a villain. The structure of dialogues also matters to me.
- So you would play the role?
- No, because I do not speak Russian. I can talk, but I would have an accent, like representatives of Caucasian ethnic groups.
- Judging by your career, there seems to be a mutual affection between you and Poland. It all started with «Hamlet» in Poznan (2019), where you were invited for the lead role by the iconic Polish director Maja Kleczewska. How did this happen?
- Maja has been following Ukraine since 2013. Initially, she was concerned that our young people were dying on the Maidan, and then in the ATO. When she decided to stage her «Hamlet» at the Polish Theatre in Poznan, she thought it would be interesting if the main character returned not to Danish Elsinore from Wittenberg, but to Poland from Ukraine.
She searched a long time for the lead actor. I missed the initial audition dates, so I simply wrote to the director afterwards, and she arranged a meeting in Warsaw. After the premiere, Maja told me that I was the only one who gave her a satisfactory answer to the question of who Hamlet was.
I told her then that I understood Hamlet - he came to reclaim power because it was unjustly taken, and that is that. It is human, and there is no need to make a philosopher out of him
I also said that we should remember that in Shakespeare’s time, people came to watch this play because it was action-packed - there are so many corpses in the end. So there is no need to seek superhuman qualities or lofty ideals in Hamlet. Certainly, he is of a delicate soul, but above all, he is a human being. Maja and I discussed this for about four hours, she understood my stance on the character. And I was cast in the role.
- And, judging by the success of Kleczewska’s «Hamlet», Poles accepted you?
- I had long wanted to enter the Polish acting market. Especially since I know Polish - though not intentionally, I learnt it as a child. I can almost perfectly understand it by ear and communicate fairly well.
- How did you learn Polish?
- When I was in the sixth grade, the only TV channels we had in our village were UT-1 and UT-2. In some towns, people could watch other channels, but we only had these, broadcasting from morning till night about how much grain Ukraine had harvested. My father bought a satellite dish from abroad, and I started watching Polish TV - specifically, the channels Polsat and Polsat-2, which featured comedy series like «13 posterunek», «The Kiepski World» («Świat według Kiepskich»), and various sitcoms… It was all so colourful, with interesting storylines.
I became hooked on Polish television and learnt Polish by listening. Later, while working in theatre, I began reading books in Polish and occasionally speaking with native speakers. Right before «Hamlet», the theatre hired me a pronunciation tutor.
- After «Hamlet», Maja Kleczewska staged a production of «Forefathers' Eve» by Adam Mickiewicz at the Ivano-Frankivsk Drama Theatre, and it was reportedly «tailored for you».
- Maja is totally my director. Our collaboration in Poznan was so inspiring for both of us that after «Hamlet», we immediately began planning future projects.
We searched for material for a long time, Maja wanted to work on a piece of Ukrainian literature, and we even discussed «Macbeth». Then the full-scale invasion happened, and Kleczewska decided she would stage «Forefathers' Eve» because, in her view, there is no other anti-Russian dramatic work quite like it in Polish literature.
We chose the third part of this poetic drama, where Mickiewicz describes Polish-Russian relations that very much resonate with what Ukraine is experiencing now in its relations with Russia. Nothing new - this is a universal story for both Poland and Ukraine, as it is fundamentally about a person’s freedom being threatened by a powerful adversary.
- In «Forefathers' Eve», you once again play a prisoner. Well, you play the proud poet Konrad, but the audience perceives you as an Azovstal defender.
- While we were working on the play, we did not even think about captivity. I was very moved when audiences started interpreting the characters on stage as defenders from Azov. After the premiere, a friend told me that when my character Konrad emerged from an imaginary basement or prison for the grand improvisation, she saw it as if an Azov commander was coming out of the trench straight into enemy fire.
People interpret things in various ways. And that is fantastic because it means the work is multi-layered and rich in meaning. That is precisely what should happen with works of talent.
- You have already walked the red carpet in Venice twice. Now you could win an Oscar - why not? Americans already know you, a critic from The Hollywood Reporter once praised your performance in «Reflection». How do you feel about fame?
- I have no problem with people paying attention to my work and praising it.
Yes, I read about myself in The Hollywood Reporter and Variety - positive reviews inspire and motivate. And humility does not lead to anything good (smiles).
As for the Oscar - one should always hope, but simply being nominated is already a huge success.
Photographs from a private archive
20
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Roman Lutskyi: «A large war always provokes micro-wars - within family universes»
«At the beginning of 2022, every Ukrainian family faced a choice - to stay or to leave. This decision led to countless conflicts. Even within my own family, we argued, trying to decide what to do next. Such things are not shown on television», said the Honoured Artist of Ukraine and one of the main actors in the Polish film «Under the Volcano»
Oksana Goncharuk
Poland has submitted a film about Ukrainians, featuring Ukrainian actors, for the Oscars. The drama «Under the Volcano» by Polish director Damian Kocur explores the transformation of a family from tourists to refugees, due to the full-scale invasion. In this film, which premiered in September at the Toronto International Film Festival, Roman Lutskyi, a well-known actor for Polish audiences, starred. He is known for notable theatrical performances, such as «Hamlet» and «Forefathers' Eve (Dziady)» by Maja Kleczewska. Globally, he gained recognition through his lead role in «Reflection», the first Ukrainian film showcased at the Venice Film Festival. Lutskyi has walked the red carpet at this festival twice, and now, he has an Oscar submission.
«This is my third film about war without combat scenes»
- Damian Kocur once said that we Ukrainians live under a volcano that could erupt at any moment, - said Roman Lutskyi to Sestry. - Under the volcano refers to a neighbouring country, armed to the teeth. In 2014, this «volcano» awakened, and in 2022, it indeed erupted…
- Since «Reflection», you have become a serious dramatic actor. Sometimes, I do not recognise where that cheerful Oleshko Popovich from «The Stronghold» has gone. Your gaze especially has changed. You have also done a drama, «Honeymoon», about a couple's life under occupation, followed by «Under the Volcano» - and everywhere there is war.
- If you have noticed, «Under the Volcano» is already my third war film without combat scenes. People understand what war is like on the front line. But the war within Ukrainian families - Europeans do not see that.
With the onset of the great war, every family had to choose - to stay or to leave. This choice gave birth to numerous conflicts. Even in my family, we argued, deciding what to do next. War provokes micro-wars - within small family universes. It is not just about the combat scenes shown on television.
- And it is precisely about such a war that you tell in each of your films. You are not running on screen with a gun, but you reveal to the world the internal drama Ukrainians go through.
- Yes, this is not action, it is subtler, and that is interesting for me as an actor.
«The director did not want to cast me because of my… «actorly» beard»
- Tell us, how did you end up in the film «Under the Volcano» and why director Damian Kocur chose you for the leading male role?
- Oh, it was quite a story. Kocur, a Polish director, is not very familiar with the Ukrainian acting market, so he asked the casting director to gather a list of Ukrainian actors for him. I was on the list, but the director initially dismissed me. As I later learned, Damian said that Roman Lutskyi was too handsome, with that overly actorly beard, and he wanted regular, ordinary people.
I was unaware of this until a friend asked me to help her record a self-tape, also for Kocur - just to stand behind the camera and argue with her on screen, and we did it. Damian saw the footage and asked who was that person behind the camera arguing so convincingly - saying he wanted the guy behind the camera. I was invited for an interview, and based on that, I was cast in one of the main roles.
- Why did Poland choose to submit the film «Under the Volcano» for the Oscars? It is not about Poles, it is about Ukrainians, and Ukrainians perform in it.
- Perhaps they saw that this particular film is competitive on the international stage and could resonate more strongly than local stories in the context of current events.
It also advocates for Ukraine. We often hear that people are tired of Ukrainians and their war, but it turns out that not everyone feels that way. The world needs to be constantly reminded of this war, and we are grateful to Poland for doing that.
There is only one question: whom should Ukrainians root for at the Oscars now - the Ukrainian film «La Palisade» or the Polish «Under the Volcano»?
In general, this film is for export. We have lived through all of this and understand very well who the enemy is. Meanwhile, the world has not fully grasped the danger of this war. Some still doubt, trying to advocate for the enemy. It is a dangerous game - to wait and not take notice, thinking that Ukraine will protect everyone. The volcano’s effects could be felt by all.
- Your first film about war was «Reflection», before that, you had not acted in such films. Director Valentyn Vasyanovych plunged you into the horrors of war at its very beginning - in 2014. Captivity, torture, PTSD... How difficult was it to act in such a film?
- As an actor, it was an intriguing challenge. It was crucial that Valentyn Vasyanovych, a deep-thinking director, made this film. The subjects of Ukrainian captivity and PTSD are weighty, and it was important to depict them correctly without exaggeration.
Viewers may have felt uncomfortable watching this film, but we know that the tortures shown in the film are experiences that Ukrainians endure in real life. Since 2014, the «Isolation» prison in the DPR territory has been a terrifying place where our people have been tortured in various ways. The worst part was that the captives did not know if they would ever be released.
I played a military surgeon who ended up in this prison. Immersed in the filming process, I lived alone in an apartment and hardly went out. At that time, I watched many videos on the subject and read numerous books. I tried to come close to that heavy and unpleasant state and to remain in it. To avoid «jumping» into it only when in front of the camera and then coming out after the director called «cut».
- Great actors, before playing a role, observe people similar to the characters they will portray. How do you prepare for roles - for instance, when playing a person with PTSD after captivity?
- I spoke at length with psychiatrists and with nurses in rehabilitation clinics.
Doctors told me how people walk after captivity - not straight, but curling up into a sort of «question mark», barely lifting their eyes from the ground
I used this technical detail about a captive’s physiology.
The film’s consultant, Stanislav Aseyev - a journalist and author of the book «The Bright Path. The Story of One Concentration Camp» - told me many things. He was a prisoner in the DPR’s «Isolation» concentration camp for 28 months and described in his book the horrors inflicted on captives there. For example, Aseyev explained in detail what a person feels when subjected to electric shock - I reproduced this in the scene where my character is tortured in this way. He described how the current passes through, which muscles contract, and whether it is possible to scream when the current goes from the ear to the hand, causing spasms in the vocal cords.
- These are very frightening things, but Vasyanovych managed to turn this material into a work of art.
- Yes, everything in Valentyn’s work is very meticulous, dry and without excessive drama. If you noticed, there is no music in «Reflection» because it would only intensify an already terrifying picture.
- You attended the screening of «Reflection» in Venice. How did the European audience respond to the film?
- After the screening, there was prolonged applause. People said that we managed to convey the filth of war through artistic means. This story moved viewers, many people cried. I would add that this film should be watched on a big screen because viewing it on a phone or even a computer does not convey the full range of emotions.
«I learnt Polish from TV by ear»
- Whom would you refuse to portray in films today? Perhaps an evil muscovite?
- Listen, but who should play Muscovites? Should we invite actual Muscovites or what? Many Ukrainian actors are fluent in Russian.
This is a reality because we are a post-colonial country. Just as Lebanese people speak French fluently, or Indians speak English. One actor or another will play a Muscovite. We do not always play likeable characters, that is our lot as actors.
Personally, I do not refuse roles, but I do refuse certain material. If it is superficial or vulgar, flat, and uninteresting, then definitely no. But if the material is deep and relevant, then I would take it on, even if I had to play a villain. The structure of dialogues also matters to me.
- So you would play the role?
- No, because I do not speak Russian. I can talk, but I would have an accent, like representatives of Caucasian ethnic groups.
- Judging by your career, there seems to be a mutual affection between you and Poland. It all started with «Hamlet» in Poznan (2019), where you were invited for the lead role by the iconic Polish director Maja Kleczewska. How did this happen?
- Maja has been following Ukraine since 2013. Initially, she was concerned that our young people were dying on the Maidan, and then in the ATO. When she decided to stage her «Hamlet» at the Polish Theatre in Poznan, she thought it would be interesting if the main character returned not to Danish Elsinore from Wittenberg, but to Poland from Ukraine.
She searched a long time for the lead actor. I missed the initial audition dates, so I simply wrote to the director afterwards, and she arranged a meeting in Warsaw. After the premiere, Maja told me that I was the only one who gave her a satisfactory answer to the question of who Hamlet was.
I told her then that I understood Hamlet - he came to reclaim power because it was unjustly taken, and that is that. It is human, and there is no need to make a philosopher out of him
I also said that we should remember that in Shakespeare’s time, people came to watch this play because it was action-packed - there are so many corpses in the end. So there is no need to seek superhuman qualities or lofty ideals in Hamlet. Certainly, he is of a delicate soul, but above all, he is a human being. Maja and I discussed this for about four hours, she understood my stance on the character. And I was cast in the role.
- And, judging by the success of Kleczewska’s «Hamlet», Poles accepted you?
- I had long wanted to enter the Polish acting market. Especially since I know Polish - though not intentionally, I learnt it as a child. I can almost perfectly understand it by ear and communicate fairly well.
- How did you learn Polish?
- When I was in the sixth grade, the only TV channels we had in our village were UT-1 and UT-2. In some towns, people could watch other channels, but we only had these, broadcasting from morning till night about how much grain Ukraine had harvested. My father bought a satellite dish from abroad, and I started watching Polish TV - specifically, the channels Polsat and Polsat-2, which featured comedy series like «13 posterunek», «The Kiepski World» («Świat według Kiepskich»), and various sitcoms… It was all so colourful, with interesting storylines.
I became hooked on Polish television and learnt Polish by listening. Later, while working in theatre, I began reading books in Polish and occasionally speaking with native speakers. Right before «Hamlet», the theatre hired me a pronunciation tutor.
- After «Hamlet», Maja Kleczewska staged a production of «Forefathers' Eve» by Adam Mickiewicz at the Ivano-Frankivsk Drama Theatre, and it was reportedly «tailored for you».
- Maja is totally my director. Our collaboration in Poznan was so inspiring for both of us that after «Hamlet», we immediately began planning future projects.
We searched for material for a long time, Maja wanted to work on a piece of Ukrainian literature, and we even discussed «Macbeth». Then the full-scale invasion happened, and Kleczewska decided she would stage «Forefathers' Eve» because, in her view, there is no other anti-Russian dramatic work quite like it in Polish literature.
We chose the third part of this poetic drama, where Mickiewicz describes Polish-Russian relations that very much resonate with what Ukraine is experiencing now in its relations with Russia. Nothing new - this is a universal story for both Poland and Ukraine, as it is fundamentally about a person’s freedom being threatened by a powerful adversary.
- In «Forefathers' Eve», you once again play a prisoner. Well, you play the proud poet Konrad, but the audience perceives you as an Azovstal defender.
- While we were working on the play, we did not even think about captivity. I was very moved when audiences started interpreting the characters on stage as defenders from Azov. After the premiere, a friend told me that when my character Konrad emerged from an imaginary basement or prison for the grand improvisation, she saw it as if an Azov commander was coming out of the trench straight into enemy fire.
People interpret things in various ways. And that is fantastic because it means the work is multi-layered and rich in meaning. That is precisely what should happen with works of talent.
- You have already walked the red carpet in Venice twice. Now you could win an Oscar - why not? Americans already know you, a critic from The Hollywood Reporter once praised your performance in «Reflection». How do you feel about fame?
- I have no problem with people paying attention to my work and praising it.
Yes, I read about myself in The Hollywood Reporter and Variety - positive reviews inspire and motivate. And humility does not lead to anything good (smiles).
As for the Oscar - one should always hope, but simply being nominated is already a huge success.
Photographs from a private archive
20
хв
Ексклюзив
Відео
Фото
Подкаст
Roman Lutskyi: «A large war always provokes micro-wars - within family universes»
Oksana Goncharuk
War in Ukraine
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Olena Rozvadovska: «Whether big or small, war always affects children»
Nataliia Zhukovska
In 2024, Russia significantly expanded the network of «re-education camps» and increased the militarisation and indoctrination of abducted Ukrainian children. Each of these children, upon returning home, requires rehabilitation - receiving a complex of various forms of assistance. How many Ukrainian children were actually abducted by Russia, what they are taught in the «re-education camps», and what are the prospects for the return of deported Ukrainians - discussed in an interview with Olena Rozvadovska, the founder and head of «Voices of Children» Charitable Foundation.
Nataliia Zhukovska: On October 2nd, seven children aged between 3 and 14 were returned to Ukrainian-controlled territory. All of them were from the Kherson and Crimea regions. This was reported by the head of the Save Ukraine organisation, Mykola Kuleba. And at the end of September, according to the ombudsman Dmytro Lubinets, nine children were also returned home. How many Ukrainian children in total have been abducted by Russia?
Olena Rozvadovska: According to open sources, Russia has deported over 700 thousand people. The official figure from the Ukrainian authorities is around 20 thousand children. This is the number we rely on. However, it is impossible to state the exact number. Since the war continues, there might be one number of children today and another tomorrow. We also do not have access to the occupied territories or Russian territory.
What happens to Ukrainian children in Russia?
Recently, together with the public association «Ukrainian Network for Children's Rights», the NGO «Regional Human Rights Centre» prepared a report based on specific cases. Our part focused on children's psychological support and rehabilitation after their return. Speaking generally about what happens, according to the children, the scenarios vary.
In some cases, there is group deportation, and they are placed in various child-like camps in Crimea or on the territory of Russia and Belarus. It is known that in the occupied territories of Ukraine, processes are underway to deprive parents of their parental rights according to Russian legislation
Children can be taken under the pretext of so-called threats to life or health without further clarification. Afterwards, they can be placed in foster families. All of this is undoubtedly illegal and constitutes a war crime, which the Ukrainian side is documenting.
How does the process of «liberating» Ukrainian children take place?
Our foundation «Voices of Children» is not involved in the return of children. In fact, each case is individual. There is no return mechanism, just as there is no mechanism for prisoners of war. Generally, the official sides cannot agree on the return of a certain number of children home. This is not that type of case. Russia does not recognise the fact that these are abducted or deported children. According to the Russians, they are rescuing them from shelling. For them, this is a «humanitarian mission». We, however, understand that this is abduction, forced deportation and russification of the nation on RF territory.
As of today, it is the relatives of the child who is in Russia that go to retrieve them. Volunteers who work in coordination with the Ministry of Integration, the President's Office, the Ombudsman, and others assist them in their logistics. That is, the relatives themselves search for those children.
What is the greatest difficulty?
The greatest difficulty is that any person who goes to Russia for the child is in a high-risk zone. There is a chance that they may not return with the child because they could be detained. Moreover, the process always involves humiliating and difficult filtration procedures and an extensive number of various checks. The return process may take several weeks or even months. In one case documented in our report, a grandmother was ready to travel to Russia to get her granddaughter. The return of the child lasted 14 months. The woman faced 18-hour interrogations at the Russian border and threats. Russia hindered the process in every way possible. To delay the child’s exit from Russia, the grandmother was made part of a criminal case. The family was only reunited after a second attempt, and only after the girl’s mother reported the obstacles faced in returning the child at a UN Security Council meeting.
The logistics are also challenging. Typically, the journey to the occupied territories or Russia involves passing through several European countries
The difficulty lies in locating, verifying, and finding these children. It is all very monotonous and complex work. According to official statistics published on the «Children of War» website, 388 children have been returned to date. As you can see, the figure is not even in the thousands. The complexity lies in the fact that there is no organised return of, for example, an entire group of children from an institutional-type facility that was taken. However, the greatest difficulty is the time we lose every day. Children who were taken at 2,5 years of age are now 5,5 years old. They may not remember what happened to them. Moreover, for the child, this is already a trauma. The longer they remain in isolation and subjected to active brainwashing, the harder it becomes to bring them back. And we understand that this is exactly what Russia is doing.
And of course, when children end up in Russian families and are adopted, these cases are even more difficult. Imagine yourself as a little three-year-old girl. You are brought into a family, and you adapt. At that age, it does not matter where the child lives because they do not understand the situation they have ended up in. They simply live.
In your recent report, you mentioned over 5500 clubs of military-patriotic education and hundreds of «re-education camps» operating in Russia and Belarus. How exactly are Ukrainian children re-educated there? How does indoctrination occur?
This research was conducted by the Regional Human Rights Centre. Their specialists describe the patriotism lessons that the children go through. In the curriculum approved by the Russian Ministry of Education, Ukraine is not depicted as an independent and united state. According to our colleagues’ research, propaganda narratives are embedded not only in textbooks but are also imposed during extracurricular but mandatory classes such as «Conversations About Important Matters» and «Lessons of Courage». The «cadet and Cossack classes» operate within schools, aimed at preparing students for military service.
One manifestation of political indoctrination is the activities of so-called patriotic and military-patriotic movements
In Russia, so-called «re-education camps» also operate. Russia spares no expense on their operation. They are very professional in their information warfare. This machine is in full motion at every level. Every teacher, adult, and school administrator knows where to get the «correct» information that needs to be conveyed to the children. And even if someone turns on the television, they will find confirmation of everything they have already been told. In these camps, there is a system of so-called patriotic education. They introduce children to their «heroes», teach them, and sing the Russian anthem. In doing so, they erase national self-identity. The Russians' goal is to make Ukrainian children see themselves as part of the Russian people.
What methods does Russia use on Ukrainian children to make them literally forget that they are Ukrainians?
It is primarily about psychological and moral pressure. Our psychologist, who worked with a boy who was returned to Ukraine, also spoke about how he endured physical abuse and torture. I know that human rights defenders are recording even more severe and horrific cases. The hardest situation in Russia is for those children who openly demonstrate their pro-Ukrainian stance. They are constantly subjected to moral pressure and intimidation. The Russians calculated that the children would break. They were constantly told: «No one cares about you, no one will come for you. You have been forgotten. If you return, you will be recognised as collaborators or as those who worked with Russia and will be sent to prison». The children, not knowing whether it was true or not, thought: «Maybe I really will be imprisoned for being in Russia?». Any scary thought can take root in a stressed mind.
.avif)
Freedom House, together with ZMINA. The Centre for Human Rights and the Regional Centre for Human Rights presented new evidence to the International Court regarding the direct involvement of the Lukashenko regime in the displacement, political indoctrination, and militarisation of education for over 2200 children from occupied Ukrainian territories. How can this evidence contribute to the return of Ukrainian children?
Firstly, it is about documenting violations. Cases in The Hague can take decades to review. Despite this, someone must continue documenting these violations. It is also about increasing international pressure. If no one speaks about this, documents it, or submits it, it may seem like the problem is resolved, and there are no issues. This needs to remain in the public domain and be discussed at various levels.
Of course, we would all like for this to be resolved in one day, and for Russia to be excluded even from the UN. However, we understand that it cannot be done so quickly
I believe that it is absolutely the right path for both state authorities and public organisations to continue working on documenting, collecting violations, and passing them on to the relevant institutions. As a result of documented violations, arrest warrants have been issued for Putin and Lvova-Belova. I am confident that Russian sanctions will only intensify. It is important not to grow tired of this work. Every Ukrainian, at their own level, must shout about the genocide that Russia is committing in today's world, right in the heart of Europe.
What is Ukraine doing to ensure that Russia is held accountable under international law for the abduction and illegal adoption of Ukrainian children?
Ukraine is doing everything within its power. International coalitions for the return of children are being created. International groups of prosecutors and investigators are working to document information on violations. Ukraine is regularly represented on various international platforms.
A wide range of measures are being taken to hold Russia accountable for its crimes - and not only those concerning children. It is unfortunate that these processes are not as swift as we would like them to be.
Your foundation, «Voices of Children», has been active since 2015. How have these «voices» changed since Russia's full-scale invasion?
Since 2015, I have been working as a volunteer with children in the east of the country along the entire frontline, and in 2019, we officially registered as a foundation. There have been many changes over nearly 10 years. In 2015, I was alone, but now our team consists of 220 people. The difference is that in 2015, the war was confined to two regions, but today it spans the entire country. Another change is that as of 2019, we had between 50 and 100 children under our care in various frontline locations and just one psychological support programme. It was very localised and targeted work. We travelled to remote villages where buses did not go. After 24 February 2022, when drones and missiles began flying across the whole of Ukraine, the format of our work changed drastically. The frontline today is more intense and much larger in scale.
Today, our centres are located in the largest cities along the frontline - from Chernihiv to Kharkiv, Zaporizhzhia, Dnipro, Kryvyi Rih, and Mykolaiv. It is not easy to work there due to the constant shelling. However, the children living there need socialisation. Their schooling is online, and they do not go anywhere - so our sessions are a small escape for them. War, whether large or small, always impacts children.
Why do parents return with their children to areas under shelling despite the danger?
It is hard to understand, but that is how it is. Everyone has their own story. You cannot say that all people have lost their minds about returning to dangerous cities and villages. That is not true! Sane, healthy, and thoughtful people are returning. The reasons vary greatly. Many simply could not settle elsewhere. People leave, spend all their money on renting accommodation, fail to find work, and return. This is the reality for many families. Some remain or return to dangerous regions because they have bedridden parents they cannot leave behind. That is why I never judge these people, although I am convinced that it is wrong to remain under shelling, especially with children.
How do you work with parents who refuse to evacuate with their children from dangerous zones?
It is a difficult process. If adults do not want to leave the area, they simply sign a refusal to evacuate. Parents bear primary responsibility for their children. Often, they refuse out of fear. Here, the state has not done enough to ensure that everyone has a clear understanding of where these people are going. They need to have at least some certainty in emergency situations. There is another group of parents who simply abuse their position and manipulate their children. Generally, these are the adults who do not take care of their children and are not interested in saving their mental health and lives. The state mechanisms must also work in these cases.
These children need to be removed. This is the job of social services, but it is not easy for them to work on the frontline. Many factors have come together to create the situation as it stands
I remember one story where we moved a family with three children from a frontline village and bought them a house in a rear area. A year later, they returned to their village. In this situation, there was nothing we could do because we do not have the right to remove children from their families.
What is the current psychological state of the children? Does it differ depending on where they live in Ukraine?
Various factors influence the psychological state of children. Certainly, the place of residence plays a role. There is a difference between living in Uzhhorod and living in Zaporizhzhia. These are two completely different realities. Obviously, the more dangerous the area of residence, the more threatening the situation for their mental health. However, much also depends on the family. A child senses the anxiety of adults. Parents are the window to the outside world for children. It is not just the rockets that scare them during war, but also their mother’s reaction to them. The presence of education, peer groups and opportunities for communication also have an impact on a child's mental health. Children in Kharkiv and Zaporizhzhia suffer greatly. Recently, we gathered children’s dreams in Zaporizhzhia, and one girl wrote: «I want this online schooling to finally end».
Our psychologists report that today, children are more frequently presenting with anxiety and depressive states, especially teenagers. Some children develop enuresis, hand tremors, and sleep disturbances. Others, due to stress or traumatic experiences, may exhibit eating behaviour disorders.
What do you think the state should do to work with children currently abroad, and how should they be brought back?
We understand that in addition to returning children abducted by Russia, we also need to work with those who are currently displaced abroad. Ukraine must be highly interested in ensuring that all working-age people, and not only children, return. For example, we often receive requests for online psychological assistance from parents abroad, as they are looking for Ukrainian-speaking specialists for their children. It is no secret that living abroad was a dream for some, but for many, it is not a fairytale.
A very large number of people dream of returning home. However, urging them to do so now is certainly wrong, as the war continues
For people to return, the economy must function, jobs need to be created, and education must develop. But first and foremost, the war must end with our victory.
Even the country with the best economy in the world cannot function normally when drones hit schools. It is abnormal and wrong. Today, hubs need to be created so that people abroad can still feel connected to Ukraine and remain within the Ukrainian information space. Moreover, we must constantly keep the world's attention focused and, of course, talk about the fact that Ukraine alone cannot counter Russian propaganda and stop such a powerful enemy.
Main photo: AA/ABACA/Abaca/East News
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«We are in the biggest drone war in all history of humankind», - a philanthropist Lyuba Shipovich
Nataliia Zhukovska
Lyuba Shipovich had been living in the United States since 2008, but after the beginning of the full-scale war, she returned to Ukraine. Lyuba is a co-founder of the «Razom for Ukraine» public organisation, and since 2023, the founder of the «Dignitas» charitable foundation, which takes care of military and veteran projects, including providing the army with UAVs and training drone operators. Last year, Shipovich was listed in the TOP 50 Ukrainian female leaders according to Forbes magazine.
Nataliia Zhukovska: Lyuba, the main area of your work is unmanned technologies: surveillance and combat drones. What is the real situation with military units being provided with UAVs today?
Lyuba Shipovich: It is about technology in general. Apart from unmanned vehicles, there is also software, situation awareness, combat control systems etc. As for the drone supply, the state is now buying them. Yes, not yet in a sufficient amount but they started doing it. However, we still lack the infrastructure for these drones. I am talking about antennas, ground control stations, portable power stations, tablets, 3D printers for explosive components of air-dropping systems. Unfortunately, this whole infrastructure is not funded by the state at all at the moment. The funding comes either from foundations or the units raise the money for this themselves.
The drone does not fly by itself. There also have to be glasses, RCs, antennas, charging devices, tablets, retranslators
What has to be done to ensure there are enough drones on the frontlines?
If we compare 2022, when there were no drones at all, to the situation now, it is significantly better. According to the prime minister, 40 billion hryvnias have been dedicated to purchasing unmanned systems this year. This already is an improvement. But it is not enough. When the President is talking about a million drones, it sounds like a lot. In reality, however, we calculated that such an amount would only be sufficient for three months in today’s frontline and combat intensity. Therefore, a million - is, in essence, a fourth part of the yearly demand.
We are engaged in an intense war, the largest drone war in the world in the history of humanity. Moreover, due to the frequent lack of ammunition, drones often replace artillery. Western countries were not prepared for a large-scale land war. NATO's doctrine is to gain air superiority. However, we are conducting a large-scale land war. Even the combined NATO countries cannot supply it with enough ammunition. On one hand, they lack the capacity, on the other hand, political and bureaucratic processes are an obstacle. We cannot rely solely on the help of our Western allies.
We must invest in our own production. And what we are doing quite well is primarily the production of unmanned technologies
It is known that Ukraine still depends on China for some components necessary for drone production. And last year, the Chinese already imposed certain export restrictions. How do you assess the risk that at some point they might completely «tighten the screws»?
We need to look for alternatives. China is the cheapest and largest manufacturer, but fortunately, not a monopolist. There are other manufacturers in Central Asian countries. Factories are also being built in Europe and the USA. And, of course, we need to pay enormous attention to localising the production of components. We should produce in Ukraine everything that can be produced here, even if it is more expensive. Because during the war, the cost is not evaluated purely based on the economic factor. There is also the factor of national security. Currently, there are several hundred stable productions in Ukraine. However, very few of them scale up production capacities because they do not have guarantees that orders will be consistent.
The state should enter into medium- to long-term contracts with manufacturers for procurement. If the contract is at least three years, it will be of interest to the manufacturer to invest in their business
This is probably the biggest problem. And if we talk about manufacturers in European countries, they generally want 8- to 10-year contracts. After all, these are capital investments in production lines, expansion of facilities, and so on.
Lyuba, you have been involved in volunteer work since 2014. It was then that the charitable foundation «Razom for Ukraine» was established in the United States. You are one of its co-founders. Since February 24, over the course of a year, you have managed to raise 68 million dollars. How did you achieve that?
Over 60 per cent of the funds came from small donations from people, mostly Americans and Canadians. They contributed 10, 20, 100 dollars to help the Ukrainian army. There were also corporate donations. Up to ten corporations donated 1 million dollars each. These were quite well-known companies worldwide that often wished to remain anonymous. I attribute this level of activity among foreigners to the fact that, at that time, Ukraine was at the top of all the news. It was a natural impulse to help in the fight against injustice.
It is also important to understand the American culture, where volunteerism is instilled from a young age. It is an integral part of life. There are even special days of the year, such as Giving Tuesday, that unite people to help each other. Currently, this support has decreased significantly, partly because Ukraine has disappeared from the news. Last December, I travelled to the United States, where Americans asked me, «Is there still a war going on?» If it is not shown in the news, it seems like it is over. But it is the same as Ukrainians not knowing what is happening in other countries. For example, in December, an important news story was about Venezuela. But if you ask Ukrainians what happened there, many would say, «Where is that?» When something is not in the news, it feels like it does not exist.
Last year, the team that worked on military and veteran projects within «Razom for Ukraine» separated into a new foundation called Dignitas. Why did this happen?
Out of the 68 million dollars that we managed to raise during the first year of the full-scale war, 45 million went to support the military. Specifically, this included the purchase of tactical medicine, drones, radios, power stations and so on. Meanwhile, the organisation also had humanitarian programs. Towards the end of 2022, discussions began about reducing military aid and redirecting more funds towards support and rebuilding efforts. At that time, I was the only board member based in Ukraine - all others were in the United States.
I tried to convey to people that it was still too early to focus on rebuilding Ukraine and that investment in defence was necessary. Because if we do not destroy the Russian tank, it will continue to wipe our cities off the map. Consequently, the rebuilding would become a never-ending process
It was at this stage that certain differences began to emerge. It became increasingly difficult to advocate that the funds were needed specifically for the military. After consulting with my team, we decided to separate into a new foundation, where it is clearly stated in the charter that we are a foundation for technological assistance to the security and defence forces, as well as veterans. We started again with zero dollars in our account.
Who forms the «core» of your team?
All those who had worked with us on military and veteran projects since 2014. The largest initiative, «Victory Drones», is led by Mariya Berlinska. It is an ecosystem for training the military in technology, specifically drone operators for the Armed Forces of Ukraine (AFU), the State Emergency Service of Ukraine (SES), and medical services in cooperation with the General Staff. There is also the «Fierce Birds» project, which supplies strike drones to the front line. It is led by Katya Nesterenko, who had worked for many years in the «Isolation» project and is very knowledgeable and understanding of the Donetsk region.
There is a project called «A Thousand Drones», which primarily focuses on reconnaissance drones. For example, in the United States, we are not allowed to raise funds for strike drones. Therefore, we have split the fundraising efforts: we collect funds for strike drones in Ukraine and for reconnaissance drones abroad.
There is also the «Fly» project, within which military personnel in rehabilitation departments are taught to operate FPV drones. This project is led by Dana Yurovich, who had previously worked for many years with the Ministry of Health team under Ulana Suprun (acting Minister of Health of Ukraine from 2016 to 2019) and on various international projects. In the tenth year of the war, volunteering needs to be professional. Yes, there were periods when everyone was doing everything when tourniquets and drones were bought indiscriminately and without understanding. But in reality, such an approach is an inefficient use of financial resources, which are already quite limited. Everyone should focus on their area of expertise.
For example, everyone knows that they need to buy a Mavic drone. However, not all understand that there is a whole line of them with different characteristics and firmware. As a result, people spend money on the Mavic 3 Classic, which is often unsuitable for use on the frontlines. But if a little more money were added, another drone could be purchased that would definitely be useful. There have even been cases where drones were bought and handed over to the military without being reprogrammed, and without anonymised firmware, they revealed positions. So, sometimes it is not just wasteful, it can be harmful to the military. That is why we do not get involved in other areas. Our focus is on technology.
For a long time, you were involved in advocating for weapons for Ukraine. What was the most challenging part, and did Western politicians always listen to you?
I continue to do this work even now. Our American team regularly communicates with congressmen and attends meetings. This work does not stop. In 2022, it was challenging to convince American politicians that Ukraine would hold out. If you recall that period, what kind of weapons was Ukraine being given? It was Javelins and Stingers - not for waging war, but for guerrilla warfare. Only in May 2022, when it became clear that Ukraine was indeed ready to fight, did they start providing heavier weapons for conventional military operations. So, until the middle of 2022, it was a matter of simply convincing them that we could and would endure, that we did not need to surrender Ukraine along the Dnipro or agree to any peace deals.
We have shown that we are ready to fight. The Western politicians and voters believed in us
What do we need to do to prevent the weakening of support from Europe and the United States?
It seems to me that Ukraine has disappeared from the news in the United States. We are not acting proactively. Look at Russia, which has been developing a network of television channels around the world for over 20 years. They broadcast in different languages - Arabic, Spanish, English, French, German, and others - meaning they generate their own content. In addition, they have a whole series of entertainment programs. They attract viewers' attention with these, and then they broadcast news between them. And what kind of news do the Russians broadcast about Ukraine? The ones that benefit them.
Where does the Western consumer get information about Ukraine? Either from the infrequent news in Western media or from Russian TV channels. We need to pay more attention to the information space and understand that foreign consumers consume information in their own language. Not Ukrainian and not always English. There is a huge Spanish-speaking world that we do not pay attention to, and the Arab world, where we also have very little information. And to gain support in those countries from politicians, we first need to gain it from their voters.
Why are there political bargaining and debates in America right now? Ukraine is a bargaining chip because voters do not have a clear opinion about us. If all voters wanted to support Ukraine, it could be guaranteed that politicians would do the same. Because they listen to their voters, especially in America, where congressional elections are held every two years. It is a relatively short election cycle, so voters are listened to constantly. Moreover, our politicians often use Western media to fight among themselves. And it is important to understand that this does not benefit us either.
When Western consumers see our internal political games, they think the war is over because local politicians are competing with each other
The major goal of the state is Ukraine's accession to NATO. This would be the greatest security guarantee for the country. Do you believe in NATO, where everyone defends each other?
I have spoken with Poles on this topic quite a bit. They are confident that they will be the next target of the Russian Federation. But when you ask them if they would go to defend their country, the response is: «Why would we? We are in NATO, the Americans will come to protect us». That is the classic answer. They do not understand that the primary responsibility is to defend their own country. And this collective NATO agreement is not about sitting back while someone else comes to fight for you. It means that we all defend each other together.
In my opinion, Russia will not go into Poland next, but into the Baltic countries. And I think that Estonians, Latvians, and Lithuanians understand this very well. They also understand that they must rely on their own forces. That is why they are actively preparing
For instance, they are conducting training for the population. When we talk about NATO countries, we think of a strong, powerful army. However, the Alliance does not have experience in conducting land wars. Right now, many of our military personnel are undergoing training abroad, and even NATO generals admit that they can learn more from Ukrainians than vice versa. Because currently, there is only one country in the world that can resist Russia - and that is Ukraine. Only we have the experience of resisting such a powerful aggressor. So if NATO sees Russia as an enemy, they are definitely interested in having Ukraine as, if not a member, at least a strong ally.
Photos from a private archive
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Ben Hodges: Russia can probably hold on for two more years
Robert Siewiorek
One of the most famous American generals, who has been acting as Senior Advisor of the American organisation Human Rights First since 2022, has diagnosed the situation of the West, Russia and Ukraine in the context of the war that has been going on for over two and a half years now in a Times Radio interview during a recent NATO summit.
What Russians are capable of
Hodges believes Russia has little space left for manoeuvring, as it can no longer lead Ukraine out of the war. Russian commanders and politicians with Putin as their leader, not caring about their soldiers, will continue sentencing thousands of others to death and disabilities day by day.
«Although, I do not think this will last infinitely, - the officer assesses. - Their human resources are limited. Even if we do not take the sanctions and their ability to transport oil seriously, I do not know if they will manage to hold on for two more years - also due to the lack of human resources and necessary components».
In the general’s opinion, the West will play a crucial role in accelerating Russia’s collapse if it takes the economic tools that have long been at its disposal seriously
At the moment, Russia is «doing what it can, waiting for us to let go of it and hoping that the potential Trump administration will make life easier for it». And this is approximately everything it can afford right now.
Putin: calculations of a bad man
In Hodges's eyes, Putin is a highly intellectual person, though simultaneously evil, merciless and such that does not care for anything but keeping power. His hopes for Trump’s possible victory are well-known: he is hoping that the USA will stop supporting Ukraine and force it to sign a peace treaty on Russian terms. On the other hand, if Biden wins [read as: the Democratic party candidate, as the interview has been taken before the President of the USA withdrew from the presidential race - Edit.], Putin will act by the already familiar plan: continued acts of diversion in Western countries and intensified disinformation that is expected to undermine the trust of the free countries’ citizens in their leaders and democratic institutions.
Biden’s policy: «catching arrows»
Hodges admires Biden’s recent promises to send more anti-aircraft equipment to Ukraine: this is significant support that measures up to the real needs of Ukrainians defending themselves. But this only solves a part of the problem. «Killing the archer is much more effective than catching all the arrows he is shooting, - the general points out. - This support package helps catch more arrows but it does not in any way help kill the archer».
From the officer’s words, the Biden administration continues to impose a «terrible policy», according to which Ukraine can not attack Russian bases in Russia using, for example, the American ATACMS systems. In practice, this policy gives Russia protection for it to commit attacks on Ukrainian cities. Yes, the general is glad to see more «Patriots» and ATGMs but it still is not enough. «I do not know what has to happen for the White House to address supporting Ukraine in defeating Russia seriously. Putin sees that we are not doing everything that is needed. He still has a big buyer of his gas, India, therefore until we start seriously helping Ukraine defeat Russia, Russians will keep on bombing Ukraine», - he warns.
Excessive fear and virtual guarantees
Hodges would like to believe that, as allies and President Zelenskyy himself say, Ukraine’s path into NATO is truly irreversible. «The issue is that there is no movement on this path», - he says. Many politicians at the summit in Switzerland contemplated what they could do about it but nothing in this chatter seems to lead to imminent and irreversible decisions. Whose opinion is that? The USA’s and Germany’s, that continue to obstruct this question, being guided by excessive fear of Russia using nuclear weapons. «Until this excessive fear is conquered, nothing will change for the better», - the general says.
- What guarantees can NATO give Ukraine and how can it strike Russia diplomatically if it can not offer Ukrainians membership right now?
Although Hodges does not imply it directly, it can be understood from his words that in this situation - there are none. As there is no 100 per cent confidence that Ukraine will join NATO. Considering that the Budapest Memorandum of 1994 [in which the USA, Great Britain and Russia guaranteed Ukraine’s sovereignty and territorial integrity in exchange for it becoming a non-nuclear-weapon state - Edit.] turned out to be an empty obligation - Hodges is not sure that the next similar commitments will be more trustworthy.
If the West fails again
The general puts all his hope into the understanding of many countries that Ukraine can not lose, that it has to win because its defeat would be a catastrophe for the whole Europe and therefore for the world as well. Because if it were to happen, the following millions of Ukrainian refugees would end up in Poland and Germany, and tens of thousands of Ukrainian soldiers would be forcefully enlisted in the Russian army, increasing its potential.
If the USA fails - be it because of a new party in power (Trump’s party) or any other reason, fails because of not having done what is needed, - the threat to Europe would not diminish but increase
In any case, it would not be surprising if the USA and more - the so-called collective West, do not live up to the expectations. In the last decade, both failed many times. «In 2008, when Russia invaded Georgia, we did nothing. The same way, when Russians crossed the lines drawn by President Obama in Syria and when they invaded Ukraine in 2014», - Hodges points out. It is not unnatural that in 2021 preparing the invasion, and in 2022 performing it, Putin assumed that the West’s anger would not amount to anything once again.
Reanimate the deterrence
The American also lists some other shocking signs of the West’s weakness that convinced Putin he was right: the Trumpist attack on Capitol Hill on January 6th 2021, the chaotic extraction of American troops from Afghanistan, Germany’s inability to stop the construction of «Nord Stream-2» despite the Russian annexation of Crimea and a significant portion of the Donetsk and Lugansk regions, President Macron’s statements about the «NATO’s brain death».
«You can imagine that amid all this the Kremlin thought: «Let’s finish this», - Hodges comments.
The war in Ukraine broke out because the deterrence failed. Therefore, it should be renewed because the world is an interconnected system. The USA’s economic flourishing, the USA President’s advisor on human rights points out, depends on the flourishing of Europe, and it is impossible if the Old Continent lacks stability and security.
«If we help Ukraine defeat Russia, this will enable us to isolate Iran, and then North Korea, which will, subsequently, deter China. Because the Chinese will see that the West has political will, industrial potential and military capabilities», - Hodges states. The defeat of Russia also is the West’s only serious protection from isolationist Trump’s coming to power.And if Ukraine does lose, the danger of China coming to «scary decisions» will rise swiftly.
When Putin falls from the cliff
How soon the Russians reach the turning point of this war and for how long Putin will keep in power depends on the dictator’s closest associates. Because he only answers to them - the oligarchs and the closest Kremlin members, not the parliament, voters or journalists who ask uncomfortable questions on behalf of those voters, as it is in any normal country. So when these people understand that there is no longer a chance for Russia to win, they will «push Putin off of a cliff and dispose of him».
Yes, the Kremlin dictator has no serious reasons to believe he will lose yet. But the day he does will be the beginning of his end
Translation: Anastasiya Kanarska
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How Ukrainian PR army fights Putin’s lies
Yaryna Matviiv
They became the voice of Ukraine in the first hours of a full-scale invasion. Ukrainian PR people were the first to tell the world the whole truth about the events in the country and opposed Russian IPSO and propaganda. Their speeches and publications have had and have millions of coverage around the world. And the most authoritative international publications prepare materials according to PR Army employees. A real army of Ukrainian PR men has defeated Russia in the information war, but the struggle continues. Our conversation with the co-founder of PR Army, which has become the unofficial press center of Ukraine in the world.
Yuliia Petrik, head of PR software development company MacPaw, became the only Ukrainian to be shortlisted for the Future is Female award from Advertising Week and Warner Bros Discovery. Talented women who have a significant impact on the global advertising industry are nominated for this award. She is also the co-founder of Tech PR School, an educational project for food companies and startups that trains them to work with Western media.
What challenges were faced by Ukrainian PR agents at the beginning of the war?
This was the initiative of the first hours of the war. We met in my education chat (I taught international PR) and I had a personal chat with my alumni. And when we all woke up to the new reality that split our lives into “before” and “after”, we were in a state of shock. In those first hours it was necessary to recover, understand whether to leave or stay, because I also have a child. The company in which I worked did not hide its Ukrainian origin, but had a wide international audience. We wrote a statement to our partners that we had started a war. Just a few seconds later, we were flooded with requests to comment on what was happening in the country.
In this work chat, one of my graduates said, “And let's do something then to tell the world the truth about war!”
It was the time of PR people. After all, we all had international media contacts. Then we formed a separate chat where we started this work. When I remember this cognitive load of the first hours, I generally wonder how we survived, because in addition to the flow of news from Ukraine: “what is there in Gostomel?”, “how are the Russian troops advancing?”, “what are the traffic jams on the borders, where people have been standing for days?”, in that chat we still began to exchange requests from journalists who could not find information anywhere from eyewitnesses, those at the epicenter of the war. We have been.
The Ukrainian Foreign Ministry was too busy in those days to work with so many foreign journalists at the same time. This is how our PR Army initiative was born. We streamed the war in online chats for international media from the first hours of the war.
That is, have you involuntarily become such a press center of Ukraine in the world?
This is a very accurate comparison, by the way, because we coordinated the work. We did not take responsibility to comment on important things, but we did find experts and eyewitnesses who commented on it for international journalists. Over time, we have already formed a large base of hundreds of speakers, as they could comment on everything that was happening in Ukraine in various spheres: from the destruction of Ukrainian agriculture to the threat of a nuclear disaster due to the Russian occupation of the Zaporizhzhya nuclear power plant.
I will allow myself to recall a few fat Russian fakes in the first weeks of the invasion, when my friend, a journalist from the Italian Associated Press, having only me in Ukraine, wrote to me via messenger: Is it true that Zelensky has already fled the country and Kiev has been left by the central authorities? I wrote back to her: Of course not! And even accused her of working on Russia. Of course, I wasn't right. She was embarrassed and apologized for not working for Russia. And then I understood the catastrophe of the information vacuum in which the world found itself regarding the events in Ukraine, and how much Russia was already paving its way into the heads of Europeans and preparing them that Ukraine would fall... Did you have such requests?
We realized then that there is a hunger for news from Ukraine on the one hand, and there is a big powerful Russian propaganda machine in the world on the other. And when a journalist came after the seizure of the Zaporizhzhya nuclear power plant and said that he was preparing material on the comments of IAEA experts, and we know that the IAEA is an organization that is generously funded by Russia, they decided to break the plans of this journalist. When the Russians seized the nuclear power plant, a representative of the IAEA arrived, pretending not to know where the shelling of the nuclear power plant was coming from.
We convened an international press conference: we found engineers, energy engineers who could comment to the world media, what is happening at the NPP and what consequences it may have. It was also dangerous for the experts, because we know that those workers who remained at the station and could comment on something immediately disappeared: the Russians took them captive and for interrogation. Therefore, we understood the danger and attracted experts who at that time were no longer on the territory of Energodar.
The second such story was about Mariupol. We had a huge amount of inquiries from the media about what was going on there. And when the first people got out of the blockaded Mariupol and were safe, we organized meetings with international journalists. Our idea was not to offer ready-made narratives, but to hear what people who have experienced all this horror tell us.
And then the world talked about the fatigue of the war in Ukraine and the war in the Gaza Strip began, and how was it possible to keep the focus on the events in Ukraine every day?
At the beginning of the invasion, there were hundreds of volunteers in our chat: journalists, designers, producers, authors of articles. Several hundred volunteers helped us search for witnesses of Russian crimes in the most remote frontline villages
And now, we see great fatigue from the war: both in the international media and in Ukrainians even more so. Because to collect such a large amount of human grief, stress, daily challenges, and even volunteering — it is already becoming impossible. Therefore, I record and see a decline in activity. We now work as such an organizing team, but it is always a question of financing. There are fewer volunteers, and this is the biggest challenge for us. Europe is already preparing for summer vacations, and foreigners are no longer so actively looking for information reasons. Therefore, we give them daily news from Ukraine.
They say that your post in X about Scholz blocking the transfer of arms to Ukraine gained so much spread that he changed his position and eventually... gave Ukraine weapons. Is this true?
It wasn't just our efforts. These efforts are both visible and invisible. Much remains outside of social networks. Great work is done by our diplomats at all levels. This is a great example of teamwork when working at different levels for the sake of a single goal.
What were your work cases then and now? In Ukraine “not a civil war”, “Zelensky did not flee the country”, “Bucha ---- real”, “Ukrainians are not fascists”, “this is not a war between NATO and America”, “Ukraine ---- not an artificial state.” ---- supplement this list of Russian IPSOs, which had to be debunked in the world media?
From time to time it is necessary to conduct educational work with the international media. But I can say that Russia works not only through the media — it is very active in social networks, like, for example, this popular botfarm “Olgin bots”. In them, the distribution of fakes on social networks is very well financed. But what is good for Ukrainians now is the possibilities of artificial intelligence. He disseminates instantaneously casts of certain narratives. We have such projects as “Osavul”, which tracks Russian intakes and gives refutations. For example, such a fake of the Russian IPSO is known, which flooded the network that the EU forces its citizens to eat insects. “Osavul” was very good at finding these chains of origin of fakes, and we refuted this nonsense.
When the Kakhovskaya dam was blown up, Russia tried to spread the information to the world media that the Ukrainians themselves had blown it up. But we already had a ready set of speaker-commentators who spoke the truth about what happened in Kherson and commented on it in the world's media. Among our speakers were deputy ministers, environmentalists, eyewitnesses. For goodness sake, we had the first volunteers to return from there. That is, we are working ahead of time in order to have time to tell the truth faster, while Russia spreads its next lie around the world.
There were a lot of requests when the first winter came with blackouts. There were questions from foreigners, how Ukrainians survive
We were asked to find for interviews a mother who teaches her child remotely or a couple who married during the blackout. The big wave of requests was when hackers hacked Kyivstar. Foreigners saw in this a new kind of hybrid war. Europeans realized that the war is not only on the territory of Ukraine and near the borders of the EU, but that the war can reach the whole world in cyberspace.
We were interested in a request from the authoritative publication Business Insider, when they asked us to find them cats to help close the meeting of the Armed Forces. We joked that something we don't do like that if the cats already have their own PR managers. But we found such cats. And here the journalist collected a list of stories about these animals, how they became popular and which meetings are closed.
Another topic that international journalists are very interested in now is the destruction of cultural heritage in Ukraine. They ask for a list of museums, cities with architectural gems that Russia destroyed with missiles. We have a list of speakers: Ukrainian and foreign experts who comment on this for the world media.
There is also a cool project at the request of NATO, in which a team of historians refutes all Russian false historiography about the supposed common heritage of Kievan Rus for Ukraine and Russia. This team refutes other Russian fakes, which have generously covered the heads of Europeans for decades.
What do you think is the greatest success of the team?
Our most recent successful cases are publications about Ukrainian women scientists for The Independent and an article with a comment by Foreign Minister Oleg Nikolayenko on Russia's actions in the UN Security Council for Express.
Also, Mark Savchuk, one of the co-founders of PR Army, regularly appears on Canadian television and comments on events in Ukraine. It has almost a million views reach
The war showed me the true value of communication. The daughter of a Kharkiv activist who was in Russian captivity wrote to us, and we made a story about him, which was circulated in the world media. Thanks to international publicity, we were able to release him from captivity. Another person whom we managed to rescue from Russian captivity due to international publicity is one of the Ukrainian sailors. This is our best success story.
We know that many well-known European publications in France, Italy and Germany are sponsored by Gazprom. We are aware of the strange statements and policies of the Vatican regarding events in Ukraine. Pope Francis, who called the Russian propagandist Dugin an innocent victim of a crime, said how great Russia and Catherine II is and admires Dostoevsky: and all this “strange love” for Russia and its “so-called culture” ---- it is also not a plowed field. Europeans are not affected by the brutal killings of Ukrainian children and muzzled Ukrainians in Bucha and other cities ---- they further blindly see in Russia some kind of “culture”. The latest example of this “pathological love” is the victory of a pro-Russian film with Russian actors at the Cannes Film Festival. What else should Ukraine do to make the world more transparent?
I myself suffer from these questions to which I have no answer. In the world media, there is now a fashion for “think positive.” Where to get this “think positive” when missiles arrive in our country, children die, people's houses burn.
We need to talk about Russian colonialism. In fact, 42 countries of the world are victims of Russia. These countries were occupied by Russia in different periods of history on four continents of the world: from Africa and the Caucasus to Europe. Here is this informational and historical fact I would raise to a higher level of discussion. We have to say in the international media that Russia is a threat to the world. Say what will happen to the world if Russia wins. We must say that Russia is a dictatorship, a lack of rights and freedoms, it is death, suffering, concentration camps and torture of people. That the world will go into complete darkness if Russia wins. To say that Putin is like Hitler, because it really is. All racism is built on the techniques of fascism.
Photo: AP/East News
As soon as the world feels that it affects them directly, then they begin to think differently
Unfortunately, now Ukraine has become a trading coin in the election races in the United States and Europe. We have to convince them that our war is really their war. For it will be like the Sudetenland, who gave to Hitler in exchange for peace, and received the Second World War. Now, if we do not stop Putin, the Third World War could explode.
You compared Putin to Hitler, and I see analogies with Stalin. When people were dying in Ukraine from the Holodomor, The New York Times, Walter Duranty wrote what a “wonderful policy of Stalin” was, and that there was no famine in Ukraine. Gareth Jones, who spoke to the world about the Great Famine, was perceived as crazy. No one wanted to believe him. Now Putin is also being whitewashed, creating from him, despite all the “normal player” in the geopolitical arena. This is done by the likes of Carlson, a number of right-leaning American media outlets. PR that the FSB does ----powerful and cunning. How to convince the world that Putin's Russia ---- is it evil?
A difficult question and I have no answer to it. The only answer is systematic cultural work in the future, because consciousness changes at least in a year. Let's be honest: for how many years, decades, centuries has Russia poured its fake history into the minds of millions? And yet, in one day, even with these terrible photos from Bucha or Mariupol, it is impossible to change your mind. Therefore, there are a lot of challenges. For example, I will be the first woman from Ukraine on the jury at the Cannes Film Festival of Advertising and Creativity. And I will have to judge the advertisements of world brands that did not come out of Russia - Pepsi, for example. And it's amazing how the world has normalized what can't be normalized. Normalized the war. World brands are already disguising themselves, creating subsidiaries under other brands and returning to Russia. And what has changed? We continue to lose territory and people.
And so every Ukrainian who has gone abroad should ask himself the question: what am I doing now to promote Ukrainian culture, Ukrainian authenticity, Ukrainian narratives?
Well... we see so many people speak Russian abroad without realizing that this is also a certain signal.
We have already received the Oscar thanks to Mstislav Chernov, we have our Nobel laureate Oleksandra Matviychuk, we have the absolute boxing world champion Usyk. We have so many victories and achievements that, to a large extent, thanks to these ambassadors of PR Ukraine, we succeeded. Although this PR is very tragic and provoked by such human dramas that we would never want. Further, after our victory, what should be the PR of Ukraine in the world?
We need to open Ukraine to foreigners: to tell what a cool country it is and what it is worth fighting for.
We can say, rotating from the perspective of time, that the PR Army defeated Russia in the information war. What is the scale of PR Army's media front now?
At the beginning of the war, we worked for seven months without any legal registration. And only then the NGO was founded. We had no name or structure at the time.
Today we have a very large base that is of value to the international community. Our project THE UA View works. Every foreign journalist can enter our base and study the stage of the Russian-Ukrainian war that interests him, read the testimonies of witnesses of Russian crimes. We systematized it. We track Russian narratives, monitor them, and counter these discards with information ecology.
On our website, information events of the war are broken down by themes and directions. A separate file is how Russia destroyed Ukrainian grain, a separate file on nuclear safety, a separate file on destroyed cities under occupation. So we created the project Voices of Freedom. It is an online platform where you can get a request from a journalist for an expert in a particular field. For each foreign journalist, at his request, we select the right speaker.
A separate direction is international experts, who are also in the list of Speaker-Ambassadors of Ukraine
We still made checks on these people or were they related to Russia somewhere in their biography. Now we have made a separate direction on the destroyed cultural heritage in Ukraine, and we are attracting international speakers who also comment on these issues for the world media.
Another project, Where Are Our People?, is about the deportation of Ukrainian children. PR Army was the first to raise this topic in the world. We were the first to say that Ukrainian children are being taken to Russia so that the world will hear us. Now we have a team of lawyers in both the States and Europe who are making sure that this topic is not forgotten. We have lists of abducted children. We are doing this project together with the 5th Morning Initiative.
Russian propagandists track your work. The Russian FSB is watching you and at some point saw that you are a danger to the Russian propaganda machine. Russia launched a whole campaign against the PR Army?
We had the following two activities: the first was at the beginning of the war. One American, who clearly works for the Kremlin's salary, made a great deal of material in a very reputable publication that a whole American botfarm operates in Ukraine, that we work according to NATO guidelines. We laughed about it, realized that we were doing everything right and moved on. But later, we were given a screenshot, where Russian propagandist Soloviev wrote about us in his telegram channel. On the one hand, we understand that if Russia is afraid of us, then we do everything successfully, and on the other hand it is dangerous.
I never now indicate in real time where I am for security reasons. I once had a conversation with Mstislav Chernov, our Oscar-winning director, and I ask him: How do you feel about security issues? And he says that in fact, the threat is constantly: both during travel and at performances. We must understand that the enemy is everywhere. The enemy is monitoring. But we must win this war in which even the word has become a weapon. And we will surely win.
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Tamar Jacoby: It may become a lonely fight for Ukraine
Iwona Reichardt
IWONA REICHARDT: You were in the United States during the final stages of the presidential campaign, and you witnessed the results in Ukraine. Were they a surprise to you?
TAMAR JACOBY: I was – it was a punch in the gut. But I shouldn't have been surprised. Now that I look at the results, I think we all should have seen it coming. We told ourselves it was 50-50, but it wasn't 50-50. Trump won by a significant margin. I don't blame the polling – I don’t think that’s the main problem. I think that people just didn't want to see a Trump victory coming. I certainly didn't want to see it. Now we need to accept that Americans have embraced Donald Trump.
It's hard to understand why exactly. Is it that voters don't believe he'll do all the crazy things he says he will do? Or is it that they really just don't like the direction that Democrats were taking the country? Why this wholehearted embrace? I’m still struggling to understand it. But clearly Americans have embraced Trump, and we are going to have to accept the choice and live with it for four years.
Speaking of the crazy stuff you mentioned, one of Trump’s promises is to end the war in Ukraine in a day, something which seems inconceivable…
Yes, Ukrainian social media had a field day with that in the first days after the election: “The clock is ticking. Don, where is the peace?” But jokes aside, I don't think he will be able to end the war in a day. I think he will find it harder to end than he thinks.
The big question will be what kind of deal does he propose? I'm very concerned about some of the deals that his advisors have suggested. The second question is how will Putin react? The response from Russia in the last two or three days has not been particularly forthcoming. The third question will be how seriously will Trump stick with his proposal? If you remember his negotiations with North Korea in the first term, he gave up after just a few days of talks.
So yes, there are many questions about his promise to end the war in 24 hours. Also, when he says he's going to walk away from Ukraine – in fact he hasn't said that exactly, but people have read his comments to mean that. We don’t know what he intends. Does he mean no new weapons from the US, or an end to all support? Or does he mean that the US will continue to provide intelligence and let the Europeans provide military aid, including by purchasing US weapons?
Bottom line: there are many versions of what could happen now, and I think people should focus on making arguments that might persuade Trump to do the right thing rather than immediately assuming he’ll do the worst
What do you think success would mean for Trump when it comes to ending the war in Ukraine?
We don't know yet. Trump is a very reactive, emotional person. So, a lot depends on how it plays out. He won’t react well if he feels that Putin is snubbing him – that could work to Ukraine’s advantage. And he won’t like it if it looks like America has somehow failed and betrayed its ally. So we just have to see. There are many unknowns and many things that need to play out. What’s important now is to try to help Trump see Ukraine in a frame that could be positive.
This gets us to the Trump-Putin relationship. Who is Putin for Trump? A friend or a foe?
Unclear. But he is still definitely a foe for Ukraine and the rest of the West. And nothing suggests a change of attitude among ordinary Russians. Ukrainian social media monitors Russian social media very closely, and there’s been a lot of talk in recent days about how America is still Russia’s enemy and America will always be Russia’s enemy. One Ukrainian headline quoted a Russian saying, “Same jerk, different face” – meaning Trump is no different from Biden, And a lot of that attitude is fanned by Putin and his allies.
The big question about the negotiations is what will Trump put on the table?
If Putin walks away, I can imagine there would be consequences – I could see Trump hammering him hard. The question is, why would he walk away? If Trump proposes a freezing of the front line and a Ukrainian promise not to join NATO, why would Putin walk away? That’s my biggest concern. But again, we just don't know.
Also, let’s not forget about the fourth big player – Europe. You have Ukraine, you have the US, you have Russia, but you also have Europe. And Europe has to get its act together and step up. We could see a scenario where Trump backs away but says “Europe, it’s your responsibility”. Europe then has to find the money and the weapons, and step in. Europeans have been talking about these responsibilities since the war began, but they haven't really done much to increase their military capacity. Poland is spending more, but Germany is still spending almost nothing, and the German government has just collapsed. That is why I'm as concerned about what's going on in Europe as I am about what's happening in the US.
Do you think Europe, and especially countries such as Poland or the Baltic states, should worry right now? Does Trump’s victory mean we are more at risk of war coming to our door?
The bottom line is that Europe has to step up. No matter who is president of the United States. Even if Kamala Harris had won, Europe would need to get going. It is not enough to talk the talk – “We have to spend more”. Europeans have to allocate the money and cooperate with each other to make every dollar go as far it can. And they have to do it efficiently. There has been a lot of talk, but the train has not left the station. I understand – things take time in Brussels, and it's complicated. But come on, hurry up. People are dying in eastern Ukraine. And this war will come to Europe’s doorstep. The threats are already on your doorstep. And in this regard, I think Trump’s election might actually help – might push the Europeans to act in a way that the situation on the front line hasn’t pushed them.
Speaking about the front line, and the overall situation in Ukraine, all the prognoses are not optimistic…
It's not good. The Russians are relying more and more heavily on glide bombs, a brutal tactic. They destroy the place they're trying to take, and then they send in men. And nobody has figured out how to counter these attacks. These are old-fashioned aerial bombs with wings, and they're huge. When they hit, they can destroy whole buildings. And that's what the Russians have done – destroyed city after city.
Meanwhile, Ukraine’s ammunition is dwindling, and the men are tired. As I understand things, this summer’s mobilization drive has largely fizzled out, and desertions are up. The Ukrainian public is still hanging in there. Opinion polls don’t show much change in attitudes toward the war over the last six months.
Life is amazingly normal in Kyiv. For me, it's great to be back. But people are tired, and I think they are waiting to see how Trump’s election will change the dynamic
Ukrainians are so tired of fighting with one hand tied behind their back, getting some American and European weaponry but not enough and not permitted to use it as they think it should be used. I lot of people are eager for something bolder – and many think that may be Trump. Many people are worried about him, but some people are hopeful. Maybe Trump will break something – will somehow break the logjam.
Do you feel the sense of abandonment in Ukraine? Do Ukrainians feel abandoned by the West, by Poland, by the US?
Those countries aren’t all the same. I think most Poles understand what is going on in Ukraine – understand the existential Russian threat. Most Europeans get it. But most Americans do not get it. They don't understand the stakes or the magnitude of the threat, unfortunately. For most Americans, this war is very far away. And their view of the stakes is more transactional than existential. But even in Europe, let’s be honest, there is more talk than action. Abandonment is a big word, but maybe it's not far from the truth. It's becoming a lonely fight for Ukraine.
What is America going to do now, during this period when Joe Biden is a lame duck and Donald Trump is president-elect?
I do not think there will be another supplemental funding package from Congress. I just don't see it. Both the House and the Senate are now Republican and under Trump’s sway. Still, a few things could happen between now and January.
We haven't spent all the money from the last supplemental, and we should rush to do that
Senator Lindsey Graham has an interesting idea: giving Ukraine the same status as Israel, opening the way to much wider access to US weapons. It's not quite NATO membership, but it's a lot better than what Ukraine has now. We should also be looking at the rules that govern how American defense contractors can cooperate with contractors in other countries.
Many of these are small things, but the point is it's way too soon to give up. There are things that can be done in the US, things that can be done in Europe. Maybe most important is what Zelenskyy and others are doing – thinking about what arguments will be most compelling to the Trump team. All of these steps can make a difference, and we have to go on. The war is not over. Ukrainians are still fighting, and Russia looks as menacing as ever, for Ukraine and the rest of Europe.
Cover photo: 24th Mechanised Brigade named after King Danylo of the Ukrainian Armed Forces/AFP/East News
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Only when women are safe will everyone be safe
Joanna Mosej-Sitek
What is «feminist foreign policy»?
Feminist foreign policy originated in Sweden. Sweden has long been a global leader in gender equality within political institutions, with women comprising 46 per cent of their parliament. In 2014, Sweden decided it was time to broaden its approach. It became the first country to base its international activities on feminist values - specifically, the pursuit of gender equality and the empowerment of women worldwide. Today, the term has taken on a much broader meaning, encompassing the representation of all social groups at risk of discrimination based on gender, age, skin colour, sexual orientation, or disability. Countries that adopt this approach view it as essential to achieving lasting peace and sustainable development on Earth.
What does this mean in practice?
For instance, it means ensuring the rights of both men and women in countries where those rights are not protected. A strong example was seen in Poland when the united right-wing government strengthened abortion laws. In response, the governments of Belgium and the Netherlands decided to support Polish women by providing access to abortion, despite the restrictive ban imposed by Polish authorities. These governments prioritised the interests of citizens over those of the Polish state or its ruling party.
Similarly, support was extended to girls in Afghanistan, despite Donald Trump’s agreement with the Taliban, and to women protesters in Iran.
Since we are part of the Western, civilised world and believe in its values - such as democracy, the rule of law and human rights - we should feel obligated to seek ways to help these persecuted groups, whether they are women, children, or ethnic minorities.
This is the essence of feminist foreign policy.
It has now been 10 years since Sweden announced this approach, followed by Canada and France. More recently, Germany has joined. It is remarkable how this traditionally conservative country is breaking the ice for women's rights.
Indeed, Angela Merkel became the first female chancellor and held the position longer than anyone before her. Ursula von der Leyen was the first female defence minister and went on to become the first woman to lead the European Commission.
At the moment, Europe is not in the best shape when it comes to the strength of progressive parties. In Sweden, despite being the founding country of feminist foreign policy, the new right-wing government has officially abandoned the term. While colleagues from the Swedish embassy assure us that little has changed in practice, it is clear that the name bothered someone. The same is happening in the Netherlands, where the new right-wing government is also moving away from this policy.
The influence of conservative, right-wing parties is visible everywhere. For the first time in decades, we are seeing a decline in women's representation in the European Parliament - 39 per cent in this term compared to 41 per cent in the previous one.
This makes the European Union's gender equality strategy all the more important. For far too long, we associated foreign policy mainly with gentlemen deciding the fate of the world over cigars and whiskey.
When Angela Merkel stepped down, Germans often shared a joke that perfectly illustrates the shift: a little boy asks his mother: «Mom, can a man be chancellor?»
This shows just how powerful examples are in changing perceptions about what women and men «can» do. The child had only ever known a female chancellor, and for him, it seemed natural.
Yes, but the few names we often cite as examples are still not enough. The reality is more like a photo from the G20 Summit: Angela Merkel surrounded by a sea of men in suits. In Poland, we are at a point where there is not a single woman on the list of presidential candidates.
First and foremost, the representation at the top depends on who is in the so-called «base» - how many women are at lower levels from which future candidates can emerge. That is why striving for equality in everyday life is so important. Whether I am meeting with local activists or political scientists from the University of Warsaw, the common theme in these discussions is always the issue of equal distribution of household responsibilities, especially childcare.
Is this still the case?
Unfortunately, yes. This is still something we must fight for. Otherwise, experts predict that real change will not happen for another hundred years or more. That means none of us, nor any girls born today, will live to see it. This is why the «base» matters so much - how we raise our daughters, and even more importantly, how we raise our sons.
Because in the end, as long as we do not impose stereotypical roles, children naturally think in terms of equality.
And when it comes to childcare, aside from breastfeeding, there are no limitations that prevent a man from taking care of a child just as well as a woman. These barriers only exist in our minds, rooted in cultural patterns and social norms
If we do not change this, we will keep hearing degrading arguments like «a woman can not be president in a country near the frontlines» or questioning whether a man with a medical background can be the Minister of Defense during wartime. Yet, we have such a minister in Poland [Władysław Kosiniak-Kamysz, Minister of National Defence, is a medical doctor].
And no one questions his qualifications. No man needs to explain to another that he is both a doctor and the Minister of National Defense in a country near the frontlines.
Rebecca Solnit's quote fits perfectly here: «A novel without women is often considered a book about all humanity, while a book with women at the forefront is categorised as women’s literature».
The system is flawed because it was created by men and for men. It is no surprise that this change is difficult for those who benefit from the current structure, the ones who make the rules.
A woman can fly to space just as a man can. She can be president, prime minister, or anything she chooses to be, and she can make her own decisions. It is about ensuring equal access to education, power, politics and the labour market, while also creating conditions that allow her to become a mother if she chooses.
Feminist foreign policy is not about excluding men, on the contrary - it advocates for equal treatment of everyone. That is why one of the tools for change includes the implementation of quotas and parity, depending on the institution and context. This is a step toward normalising what is still seen today as revolutionary.
In Poland, we certainly have a long way to go. Women make up only 30 per cent of all parliamentarians, one of the lowest rates in Europe. However, regardless of the country - except perhaps Sweden - women pay a higher personal price for a political career than men do. They are constantly asked how they balance their careers and motherhood.
And if they do not have children, like Kamala Harris or Angela Merkel, it becomes another source of criticism. Women who reach the top pay a steep price or have already paid it on the way there. New Zealand Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern stepped down from politics for personal reasons. Ursula von der Leyen started her political career at 40 after raising her children, yet she still faced years of ridicule for supposedly advancing her career at her children's expense. Men are not held to the same scrutiny. Von der Leyen was criticised for almost everything, «pursued» in ways few politicians in Germany have experienced.
A striking example is Magdalena Filiks. It is no coincidence that the intense bullying campaign, which ultimately led to her teenage son's suicide, targeted a divorced woman and single mother. Similarly, Minister Joanna Mucha admitted she almost gave up when she saw how the harassment impacted her children. This kind of targeted bullying happens to women in politics far more often than it does to men.
However, we have no choice but to endure it, to push through until real change happens. Yes, there will be moments when we’ll face malicious comments and condescending attitudes, but change will come, and the system will eventually adapt.
The creation of the FemGlobal Association is another step towards increasing the presence of women in international politics and the public sphere.
It is clear that the visibility of women in public spaces - as experts in panel discussions or commentators on television - is crucial for shifting public consciousness.
According to the most recent available data, female experts make up only 23 per cent of those featured in Polish media. That is why in our association, we have created a database of female experts in international politics, and we work hard to ensure they are represented in the media. For example, when the Taliban took over Afghanistan, I watched perhaps the fifth program on a particular TV channel covering the situation, and it only featured male commentators. I reached out to the editor and suggested some of our female experts, and it worked. I closely monitor this phenomenon of increasing women’s invitations to TV. It happens twice a year: first on March 8th, and then on October 20th, when they are invited to comment on the Constitutional Court's ruling on abortion. After that, it fades, and we return to the norm, where men are the first to be chosen. Recently, during a meeting at the Mexican embassy, I explained why Poland still hosts debates with only male participants, while in Mexico, such debates are no longer acceptable.
In the report you and Iwona Reichardt co-authored in 2020 «Will Women Save the World? Feminist Foreign Policy», you mentioned war as a threat to the development of feminist foreign policy. Defence and security remain highly masculinised fields.
Of course, security, understood in the traditional sense as armed action and military struggle, typically requires endurance and strength and is primarily associated with men. However, this too is changing; for instance, more than 67 thousand women currently serve in the Ukrainian Armed Forces. There is no other army in the world with such a number of women.
What about Israel?
In Ukraine, there are over 5 thousand active female soldiers fighting on the frontlines. This is truly a unique phenomenon that the entire world is observing. It is an experience from which others will also learn. Although, of course, it is immensely tragic, as is any war. Yet these women are showing other women, in other places and in other armies, that it is possible. Others need not wait for war to create the necessary conditions, career paths, uniforms, and body armour that allow women to be fully-fledged soldiers. The United Nations' agenda on «Women, Peace and Security» also encompasses gender equality in the armed forces.
But security is not just about military action.
Exactly, I believe the time has come to broaden the concept of national security and introduce a feminist perspective, as this is an even more male-dominated area than foreign policy, where men also predominate. Security is not solely about purchasing Abrams tanks or F-35 aircraft. A feminist perspective involves the participation of women in decision-making, mediation and negotiations.
At the same time, in conflict situations, the feminist perspective becomes particularly significant, as it is precisely in such times that women and children require special protection.
The importance of this was aptly highlighted by the German Foreign Minister, Annalena Baerbock, who said: «The question is whether families, children in the heart of Europe, in the centre of our Europe, can be safe and grow up in peace. Only when women are safe will everyone be safe».
For our own security, it is also crucial that we know where the nearest shelter is, which medicines to prepare, and how to act in an emergency. The state must allocate resources to equip us, as women, with this knowledge and these skills
The issue of security also includes ensuring access to fast, legal and safe abortion services. This is because we know that rape is now regarded as a method of warfare.
You are also an expert on migration policy. Given the current situation following the war in Ukraine, it is arguably one of the biggest challenges facing the European Union. I am not sure if feminists will save the world, but I fear that migration policy, or rather its absence, might well bring Europe to its knees.
Firstly, migration has always existed and will continue to do so.
However, there has been a noticeable increase in recent years.
Indeed, because the global population has grown, and for some, we have become a destination country. But let us take a look at our families, at our immediate surroundings. Each of us has someone who has emigrated abroad.
So the problem is not migration itself, but the lack of discussion around it. The greatest failing is that politicians, from the centre to the left, are afraid to speak about it, thereby leaving the issue to the right and far-right politicians. They exploit this silence, this ignorance, and this fear.
People have a right to be afraid, to feel uncomfortable. If we do not discuss these concerns and relieve this tension, discomfort will evolve into hostility.
But what should we be talking about?
First and foremost, we should inform. We need to show that migration is a phenomenon that has always existed and will continue to exist. Furthermore, that we, Poles, have also migrated and live in various parts of the world.
Secondly, I believe that schools should be places of integration. They provide a space where both sides can meet. All children in Poland are entitled to compulsory education, so schools can serve as a venue for fostering integration and teaching openness. Moreover, this should be a mission of public television as well: education, combating stereotypes, and social campaigns. Without this, we fall victim to populists and disinformation.
I feel as though that has already happened.
Perhaps things are not as dire as they seem. Hostility towards foreigners must be dismantled through education and experience. The more direct contact one has with foreigners, the less one fears them. Interestingly, the greatest fear of immigrants is found in eastern Germany, where there are the fewest. This is because it is easiest to manipulate perceptions and prejudices in such areas, where disinformation thrives.
Business must also serve as a platform for a positive narrative. Businesses need foreign workers due to a shortage of labour in the market
In Poland, an impressive 62 per cent of Ukrainians found employment within their first year after arriving. This is a phenomenal result on the international stage.
What is the usual situation?
On average, it is estimated that around 30 per cent of migrants find employment within their first year. Another 30 per cent enter the labour market within two to three years, needing time to retrain, learn the language, and adapt. The remaining 30 per cent never secure employment, either because they had not worked in their home country, or they are elderly, ill, traumatised, or otherwise unable to work.
How can such a result be explained? Is it due to a lack of social programmes or low welfare payments?
Firstly, Poland already had a relatively large Ukrainian community, which has helped newcomers access the job market. Secondly, it is a matter of the social group. Many of those who arrived in Poland are highly educated, middle-class individuals with in-demand professions, such as doctors or IT specialists. And, of course, language plays a role, as Ukrainians find it considerably easier to learn Polish than German or French.
It is precisely this narrative - that Ukrainians contribute to our GDP - that should permeate public opinion, rather than the notion that they are living solely off benefits.
Exactly. People just need help adjusting to this, because it is a new experience of this scale, and it is natural for it to be challenging. In such circumstances, we often look for someone to blame, typically targeting those perceived to be lower on the social ladder. Migrants are always viewed as being lower - lower than those from the so-called Poland «B» (a term symbolising the less developed areas of the country, as opposed to Poland «A», the more developed regions), lower than those from rural areas. This is why we need a wise state policy.
We must ensure that Poles feel comfortable and secure in Poland because this helps them accept that others can also feel comfortable here.
This is where feminist policy comes in, advocating for equality, inclusivity and social justice.
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German Bundestag member Roderich Kiesewetter: «The reduction of German support for Ukraine is the consequence of a lack of priorities»
Maryna Stepanenko
Following the announcements about the next year’s support reduction, Germany sent additional weaponry to Ukraine, among them are new Anti-aircraft weapons, UAVs, rifles and ammunition. But the amount of funds Germany will dedicate to Kyiv’s defence needs in 2025 remains unknown until Autumn.
What is the current mood within the government and the Bundestag? Will the support change, and could the successful raid in Kursk have an impact? Furthermore, how might the latest findings from the investigation into the Nord Stream pipeline explosions affect relations with Ukraine? These and other questions were addressed in an exclusive interview with Sestry by Roderich Kiesewetter, a member of the largest opposition faction, the CDU/CSU, in the German parliament.
Aid to Ukraine vs «Nord Stream»
Maryna Stepanenko: The German publication Frankfurter Allgemeine Zeitung (FAS) reports that Germany will limit its aid to Ukraine in the near future. Our Ministry of Foreign Affairs has already called this information manipulative, stating that negotiations regarding the budget for next year are still ongoing in your country. Last time, after lengthy negotiations, the funding level for 2024 was raised from 4 to almost 8 billion euros. What about next year? What is the current mood and thinking in the Bundestag?
Roderich Kiesewetter: The Bundestag and the government have differing views. The government would like to limit aid to Ukraine, with plans to cut it in half in 2025 and finance it outside the federal budget. This is not just indicated by the government itself, but also by the German Chancellor's Office.
The Ministry of Foreign Affairs and the Ministry of Defence are advocating for increased support, but Scholz's office has instructed the Ministry of Finance to freeze it. We have an annual budget of around half a billion euros, and debates are focused on the 17 billion that are missing from the federal budget for next year.
And now, to compensate for those funds, the support for Ukraine has to be reduced, especially the military support
This reflects a lack of priorities and a clear position. The problem is that the government, particularly the Chancellor's Office, wants to cut aid to Ukraine for internal reasons. To justify this decision, one could tie it to the leaked information that Ukraine might have destroyed the Nord Stream pipelines. If this is the case, it is not even a punishment but a strange framing of incorrect, reckless information from certain investigative journalists. This does not seem like a coincidence.
It seems intentional that, in the same week when two different groups of investigative journalists try to blame Ukraine for the destruction of the Nord Stream, which could be a covert action by Russia, budget cuts that harm Ukraine are being discussed.
The Wall Street Journal (WSJ) investigation into the September 2022 sabotage of the Nord Stream pipelines suggests the alleged involvement of Ukrainian officials - President Volodymyr Zelenskyy and then-head of the Armed Forces, Valeriy Zaluzhnyi. What are your thoughts on this?
The WSJ article came out in competition with a piece by the German publication Spiegel, which was released a day earlier. Both publications seem to be steering toward the conclusion that Ukrainian officials gave the order to destroy Nord Stream.
The WSJ investigation is indeed puzzling because it claims that Russia was earning billions of euros from Nord Stream, which is not true. Since July 2022, not a single gallon of gas has flowed through the pipeline, and even in the preceding months, only 40 per cent of the promised supply was delivered. So, if Ukraine had destroyed it, they would have essentially been «killing a dead horse». Why would they expend their efforts on that?
Secondly, if Zelenskyy was unable to communicate with the team that received the order to destroy the Nord Stream, why was this team reachable via satellite phone? That also does not add up. Thirdly, there is mention of a person referred to as Volodymyr Z. (in German publications - Wolodymyr Z. or Wladimir S., depending on the transliteration - Author) with a Ukrainian passport, but no one mentions that he could have had other passports, like Diana B. (another suspect according to the investigators' version - Author). She was the owner of the company that rented the yacht «Andromeda», but she also held a Russian passport. She lived in Crimea and is now in Krasnodar, so she is Russian, not Ukrainian. Furthermore, there are no witnesses, there are only secret sources. In my opinion, the WSJ story is inconsistent and implausible.
I do not believe this because if Ukraine had done something like this, it would have become public knowledge and would have caused harm to Kyiv. Therefore, I can not imagine that the Ukrainian government destroyed the Nord Stream pipelines or ordered such an action
The former head of German intelligence, August Hanning, previously suggested that Poland could be involved in the sabotage of the Nord Stream pipelines. In response to the ongoing investigation, Polish Prime Minister Donald Tusk advised all initiators and patrons of the blown-up pipelines to «apologise and keep quiet». How do you assess such a statement?
Hanning does not question the findings of these questionable investigative groups, which annoys me, but it does not surprise me. Many former high-ranking officials in Germany have very close ties with Russia and a longstanding pro-Russian tradition, which we need to take into account. Russia uses pro-Russian voices in science, media, economics, and politics for its information warfare and can use them for deeper psychological operations. These individuals may appear authoritative but, in reality, become tools of a hybrid war in favour of Russia.
There is a group in Germany trying to make Ukraine the scapegoat to justify halting support. I can not explain Tusk's role, and we must be very careful not to resort to insinuations or accusations
I know that the German federal prosecutor is very upset about this story because it jeopardises his own investigation - the leak likely came from politically responsible people in the Chancellor's Office. He can not work as he should because those who destroyed the Nord Stream pipelines are now warned. And that is where the danger lies now.
If these individuals are in Russia, they are breathing a sigh of relief since Germany believes that Ukraine destroyed the pipelines. Therefore, we must be very cautious with Hanning's statements, Tusk's remarks, and, in general, with any hasty accusations.
Friends of Russia in Germany
The German prosecutor's office has issued an arrest warrant for a Ukrainian suspected of sabotaging the Nord Stream pipelines. Two other suspects are also believed to be Ukrainian. Beyond military support, could this impact other areas of cooperation between Germany and Ukraine?
Those who spread these likely fake news stories about the Nord Stream pipelines aim to end German support for Ukraine, undermine trust, and force Ukraine into capitulation. However, they disregard Ukraine's will and strength and fail to consider the Ukrainian population, which does not want to live under a frozen conflict or Russian occupation.
Ukrainians would leave their country if Kyiv were forced into a ceasefire. This is because, on the other side of the border in Russia, brutal violence is being committed against civilians. Ukraine, therefore, does not want to be forced into a ceasefire, as some in Germany, like the Chancellor and others, might prefer. We must be very careful to ensure that no forces on the ground undermine Germany's willingness to support Ukraine.
We have upcoming local elections in Thuringia, Saxony (on September 1), and Brandenburg (on September 22). In these three federal states, there are forces influenced by Russia: the Sarah Wagenknecht Alliance (BSW) and the Alternative for Germany (AfD), which are partially funded or influenced by Russia. Thus, we must be very cautious about any context that benefits the Russian Federation. There is no direct funding, but people from these parties receive money for their personal interests and work within the parties.
There is indeed competition within our country between those who want to see the strengthening of an international order based on the rule of law and those who support the principle of «might makes right» - the power of Russia - and who see Ukraine as a necessary sacrifice for peace with Russia
But they do not realise that Russia does not want peace. Russia considers Ukraine a legitimate part of itself. Therefore, the Russians will continue the war against Ukraine and their hybrid war against Moldova and the Baltic countries. There will be no peace. This is the imperial mindset of Russia, which is not understood by those who wish to stop supporting Ukraine.
Returning to the budget and aid, if German lawmakers allocate no more than 4 billion euros to Ukraine in 2025, what will this mean for Ukraine's defence capabilities?
First of all, Germany is not the only supporter and not the strongest one. Other countries that provide more aid relative to their GDP are Denmark, Norway, Poland, the Baltic states, Sweden, Finland, and the United Kingdom. So, there are other, much more reliable partners.
Secondly, 4 billion euros are already planned. They will be invested in spare parts, ammunition, air defence, and so on. But there is no room for additional support from the regular budget. Therefore, it is crucial for Germany to provide Ukraine with additional assistance ranging from 4 to 10 billion euros next year. The government claims that the interest rate on frozen Russian assets should serve Ukraine's interests.
However, there is still no unified position on this in the European Union. This issue is absolutely unclear and depends, for example, on Hungary's support
In any case, the entirety of frozen Russian assets already belongs to Ukraine. This does not replace the necessary support from Germany and other countries. Therefore, the German government's argument is a kind of distraction, an excuse, and an evasion of responsibility.
On February 16, the German Chancellor, together with President Zelenskyy, signed a security agreement. On that date, he committed to supporting Ukraine for as long as needed, within its 1991 borders. But that signature is not worth the ink it is written with if Germany does not increase its support, and the security agreement holds no real value.
Kursk offensive and German Taurus
In February, in one of your interviews, you said, «the war must be brought to Russian territory», and that «Russian military facilities and headquarters must be destroyed». Six months later, the Ukrainian Armed Forces began an operation in the Kursk region. What was your first reaction?
It was a sigh of relief because, in February, I demanded that we allow Ukraine to transfer the war to Russian territory, cut off Russian strongholds and supply chains, and strike Russian positions, ammunition depots, and those responsible for the war - their ministries, command centres, and logistics zones. For this, I was criticised by my party colleagues and some media. Now, I feel vindicated.
Such operations make sense from a military strategy standpoint, are permitted under international law, and, if successful, provide operational advantages. I am a former military officer. Before entering our parliament, I worked for almost 30 years in international organisations, NATO, the European Union, and the Armed Forces. I have a good understanding of what war entails and what is necessary to deter it and conduct successful operations.
On the other hand, as our defence minister said, it is quite normal for a country under attack to conduct war on the aggressor's territory. This is an entirely normal phenomenon in the world - our defence minister said last April on a talk show. But when I mentioned it in February of this year, people responded that this was warmongering. I argued that it was a necessity, and that is indeed the case.
Ukraine's operation in Kursk seems both correct and effective. We will see how sustainable its success will be, but for now, it is a significant victory for Ukraine. This is the right response to those who still believe in appeasement with Russia
Germany does not question the legality of the actions of the Ukrainian Armed Forces in the Kursk region and does not object to the use of German weapons on Russian territory. However, does the Kursk offensive change the opinions of German politicians about supplying Ukraine with long-range TAURUS missiles?
Unfortunately, no, because in the Social Democratic Party, the faction leader and a very important high-ranking politician in the Chancellor's Office oppose allowing Ukraine to destroy Russian communications, supply chains, etc. This is a deadlock.
My party, the CDU/CSU, strongly supports the transfer of TAURUS missiles, but Chancellor Scholz's office is blocking this. The defence minister wants to proceed with the supply, and the foreign minister supports it as well, but there is no political will because a unanimous government vote is required, and the Social Democratic Party is blocking this issue.
It is necessary, now more than ever, to supply several hundred high-precision, long-range strike systems, such as the TAURUS missiles. We also need to enable our defence industry to produce more tanks, more ammunition and more artillery.
However, this reflects a lack of political will and a deficiency in strategic culture and thinking. It is a spirit of appeasement, reminiscent of Chamberlain in 1938, rather than the approach of Churchill. We have yet to experience a «Churchill moment» in Germany. I am working on changing that
Pressure on Putin
In your opinion, how might the Ukrainian raid impact the situation inside Russia?
In the past, we have seen that when Putin has been under pressure, as during the Wagner Group mutiny, he has shown a preference for negotiations. At that time, he instructed Lukashenko of Belarus to help defuse the tense situation. Lukashenko persuaded Prigozhin to stop and go into exile in Belarus, but Putin later had him killed. So, when Putin is under pressure, he tends to negotiate or make concessions.
The Ukrainian raid provides an opportunity to not only create a buffer zone but also gain leverage in negotiations. For example, if there are future negotiations where Russia is required to withdraw from all of Ukraine, they might be allowed to retain the Kursk region in exchange. This could strengthen Kyiv's negotiating position, but pressure on the Donbas continues to mount. We will see whether the offensive in the Kursk region will ease the situation on other parts of the front, forcing Russia to retreat and redeploy its troops.
Ukraine is losing territory and hundreds of soldiers every day, so Western support needs to increase. In this regard, Germany is sending a very negative signal
Negative for Ukraine because Putin sees that Germany is weak in the knees. It is also problematic for the United States, as those who support isolationists, including Trump, could argue: «Why should we support Ukraine when the Germans are stepping back?» The narrative becomes, «This is Europe's issue, not that of the United States».
It would be a major failure for Germany if we were to lose the United States' support during the upcoming election campaign. That is why we need to invest more and do more. Ukraine must hold its ground and even expand its territory, it should continue the war on Russian soil to be in a better position if forced into negotiations. Ukraine needs to destroy Russian military targets such as missile launchers, airfields, and ammonia depots to limit and, hopefully, stop Russian attacks on Ukrainian critical infrastructure and civilian populations.
I see that there are people in the German government who would like to lift the artificial restriction that the United States and Germany have placed on Ukraine's use of Western weapons on Russian territory. We need countries like the Baltic States, Poland, the Czech Republic, the Scandinavian nations, the United Kingdom, Denmark, and others to increase pressure on Putin, as well as to press Germany to do more. At the moment, Germany is increasingly isolating itself in Europe as a country that does not act according to its economic power. We need to do more and motivate other countries to do the same.
After all, when it comes to rebuilding Ukraine, why should Germany benefit from it? The countries that have genuinely supported Ukraine should be the ones involved in Ukraine's post-war revival.
«We should all fear a weak and unprepared Germany»
Michael Giss, the Commander of the Bundeswehr's Hamburg Regional Command, recently stated that Germany must be prepared for a potential Russian attack within the next five years, given its role as a key NATO transport hub. What is Berlin currently doing to strengthen its defence capabilities?
That is an excellent question. Firstly, it is important to note that we are not talking about five years but rather two to three years. Russia is aware that the West is increasing its pace and losing time and resources. Therefore, they will intensify pressure through disinformation, sabotage and preparation for war over the next two to three years to outpace Europe's efforts.
Secondly, Germany experienced its Zeitenwende in 2022 (referring to Chancellor Olaf Scholz's address to the Bundestag on February 27 2022, following Russia's invasion of Ukraine, where Scholz described the attack as a «historic turning point»). However, that was just a speech - it is already history.
The Defence Minister is not receiving the necessary funding. All his requests have been curtailed. He is getting less money than needed to offset inflation and increase soldiers' pay. As a result, the German Armed Forces lack the support needed to improve their position. This situation is expected to worsen in the next two to three years.
By the late 2020s, when the German Armed Forces are truly at the limits of their capabilities, we will need much more fresh funding. We are talking about an additional 300 billion euros by the end of this decade to modernise our military, but they are only receiving between 5 to 10 billion euros - a small fraction of what is required.
This will reduce the capabilities of the Armed Forces and lower the morale of German soldiers. It is a victory for pacifists and the Social Democratic Party, who are deliberately weakening our military. We have Pistorius, the best Defence Minister in the last 20 years, yet he is not getting the necessary funds. He is a Social Democrat, but even he is not receiving the money needed, which isolates him. And that is very unfortunate.
One day, we may wake up to even greater pressure from Russian propaganda and increased Russian aggression. If we do not recover, we could face a situation akin to the second Jena and Auerstedt (the destruction of the Prussian army by Napoleon in 1806 - Author). Therefore, we need to raise this issue within Germany, but our friends and partners must also step up the pressure.
We need a strong Germany, as Radosław Sikorski said 12-13 years ago: «I fear a weak Germany much more than a strong one»
We should all fear a weak and unprepared Germany because that would be an invitation for Putin.
Cover photo: Action Press/Shutterstock/Rex Features/East News
This project is co-financed by the Polish-American Freedom Foundation as part of the «Support Ukraine» program, implemented by the «Education for Democracy» Foundation
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Exclusive
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«The deadliest F-16 pilot» of the American Air Force Dan Hampton: «F-16s arrived in Ukraine just in time»
Maryna Stepanenko
<add-big-frame>After many months of preparation and pilot training, the mighty roar of F-16 engines can finally be heard over Ukraine. The first shipment of 10 American-made fighters is already performing combat missions, and their presence can be felt on the frontlines. <add-big-frame>
<add-big-frame>Our modern fleet is expected to be joined by 20 new planes by the end of the year. While Ukrainian pilots are training, Kyiv could ask NATO member states about recruiting retired pilots. <add-big-frame>
<add-big-frame>«The deadliest F-16 pilot» of the American Air Force, retired Lieutenant Colonel of the United States Air Force Dan Hampton, also known as Two Dogs, is among those wanting to help Ukraine resist Russian aggression. He spoke about his ambitions to fight and how F-16 will turn the tables of this war in an exclusive interview with Sestry. <add-big-frame>
Marina Stepanenko: Mr Hampton, the first F-16s have finally arrived in Ukraine - how do you assess the journey from a categorical «no» to a definitive «yes»?
Dan Hampton: I think snails move faster, but you know, that does not matter anymore. I wish this had happened a year and a half or two years ago, but now that they are here, the focus should be on using them as effectively as possible to win the war.
Mr Hampton, you are one of the most decorated fighter pilots since the Vietnam War. Over your 20-year career, you completed 151 combat missions in the Middle East during both Gulf Wars. From your professional perspective, what should be the main priorities for the 10 aircraft we currently have? How should we use them?
Of course, it depends on your Air Force and your government, but I am confident they will agree that the first priority should be clearing the skies over Ukraine of Russian aircraft. Once you have air superiority and control your skies, you can move freely on the ground and do whatever you need to do. The Ukrainian Air Force has done a great job and shown immense bravery over the past few years, but I think the F-16s have arrived just in time.
If Ukraine can secure its airspace, it will have many opportunities to carry out other necessary operations to drive the Russians out
By the end of the year, the number of F-16s in our arsenal is expected to increase to 30. In your opinion, what opportunities will this open up for us?
The real advantage of the F-16, and what truly frightens the Russians, is that this aircraft can perform so many different tasks, and the pilots are trained to execute a wide variety of missions - whether it is close air support, air combat, or taking out surface-to-air missile systems - anything. So, the more aircraft you have, the more flexibility you will have to carry out multiple missions simultaneously, depending on the need.
Overall, Ukraine is expected to receive 79 F-16 fighters. President Volodymyr Zelenskyy has previously stated that to counter Russia in the sky effectively, we need at least 128 aircraft. So, my question is: will the promised number of F-16s be enough to impact the dynamics of the conflict and strengthen the military capabilities of the Ukrainian Armed Forces?
Absolutely. I mean, 30 aircraft would be a very strong start. That is roughly the size of one United States Air Force fighter squadron. So, if you end up with 79 or 80 aircraft, that is almost three squadrons. You could position them in different parts of the country, allowing them to conduct various types of missions. This would give you significant flexibility to support Ukrainian ground forces and push the Russians back across the border.
In Russia, they are trying to downplay the capabilities and potential impact of the F-16s on the battlefield. Yet, recent attacks suggest that the Russians are also targeting American F-16s by striking airfields. What does this behaviour and these actions from the aggressor indicate?
Desperation. They are trying to downplay the role of the F-16 because they have not been able to control the skies over Ukraine for over two years. And they know it. They know they can not advance on the ground without air superiority. They tried to achieve this in the first 10 days of the war, but the Ukrainians completely shattered them. So, of course, they are going to say things like that. But who believes what the Russians say, right? I mean, they make everything up. They lie. It is propaganda.
If I were there with my colleagues, flying and fighting alongside the Ukrainians, they would not need to find me. I would find them myself. And I am confident your pilots feel the same way. So, it does not matter what the Russians say
United States Senator Lindsey Graham, a Republican, has stated that he plans to ask President Joe Biden for permission to allow retired pilots to fly on Ukraine's behalf. You have previously mentioned that if you could, you would come to Ukraine and fight on our side. Do you still have that desire?
Absolutely. We are working on it. It is challenging for former officers, but I believe we will make it happen. There is a big difference between a volunteer with a rifle joining the ground forces and a former military officer flying to fight for Ukraine. So, these are political issues that, I hope - really hope - will be resolved very, very soon.
How do you feel about the idea of basing Ukrainian F-16s abroad for security reasons, for example, in Poland? There, you have good runways and maintenance capabilities. After all, Russia has kept its aircraft in Belarus and launched attacks from there.
It is no different. You know, everyone makes a big deal about not using Western weapons to strike Russian territory. But they constantly do it to Ukraine, don’t they? The Russians are using lousy North Korean ammunition, foolish drones from Iran, and other weapons. And, you know, it does not matter.
Regarding the use of Poland, it is a political issue. And since Poland is part of NATO, it makes the situation a bit more complicated. I do not have a definitive answer for you. I think Ukraine aims to have several well-protected airbases within its borders, where these aircraft can be serviced, repaired if necessary, and continue flying.
I do not think Ukraine wants to rely on anyone else, and you should not have to. And if everything goes as it should, you will not need to rely on others. You will get all the help and equipment you need, the political issues will be resolved, and you will win the war.
Do you foresee any logistical challenges in deploying and maintaining the F-16s in Ukraine?
You know, I can not give you a definite answer because I have not seen where these planes are based or what agreements have been made. I know that your government and military are smart enough to think through all of this, and they have had enough time to prepare for the arrival of the F-16s. So, I have to believe that everything necessary to keep these aircraft flying and fighting has already been established.
The United States will provide the F-16s with domestically produced missiles and other advanced weaponry, including the latest version of the AIM-120 AMRAAM air-to-air missile and the AIM-9X short-range air-to-air missile. Can you tell us what this weaponry is capable of?
This is a very good decision because you definitely need this weaponry, and it makes the F-16s significantly more dangerous for the Russians. The AIM-120 AMRAAM is an active radar-guided missile, which means that the aircraft launching it does not need to keep the enemy on its radar. It can fire the missile, which has its own radar inside, and it will head towards the target and destroy it. This allows the launching aircraft to target multiple enemy planes at the same time, and the missile will do the rest.
As for the AIM-9X, it is an infrared missile with a high range. You do not necessarily need to aim directly at the target. You could be sideways to the target, and the AIM-9 will find the heat source and take it out.
So that is good. This is top-notch weaponry used by our Air Force, and I am glad we are providing it to the Ukrainian Air Force
Despite the extensive support of F-16 weaponry, the United States still prohibits strikes deep into Russian territory from these jets. What could change Washington's stance on this matter?
That is a very good question. I do not understand politicians, so I can not figure out what they are thinking. I believe it is foolish to give someone a weapon and then tell them they can only use it up to a certain point.
And if Washington is trying to maintain some sort of friendship with Moscow for whatever reason, I do not see the point. I do not care what Vladimir Putin and the Kremlin think about Western weapons reaching Ukraine. After all, they are attacking Ukraine with their own weapons and those they are receiving from other countries, aren’t they?
So, what is the difference if the situation were reversed? Russia is not going to do anything reckless, like attacking NATO or the United States Even Putin would not go that far
I would like our government to be less timid and say, «Hey, this is your weapon, use it as you see fit». What are we going to do, take it back? I do not think so. So, I believe that once you have the necessary weapons, if the situation allows it, you will be able to use them as you deem appropriate.
What do you think should be the first target if we get the green light from Washington?
Airfields from which they launch those drones at your cities, and where they base their fighters and reconnaissance planes - that is what I would target. I would destroy the airfields and take out as many of their aircraft on the ground as possible. Again, I do not have the same information that your Air Force and government do.
I am confident that right now, they are doing what is best for Ukraine, and in the future, things will only get better
How effective do you think the training of Ukrainian pilots has been, considering that its duration had to be shortened to record lengths?
Yes, that is true. It was shortened. But your pilots were not complete novices. They all flew MiGs or Sukhois and were already fighter pilots. So, it is just a matter of teaching them to operate a new aircraft, learn new tactics and adapt to new equipment. The F-16 is very different from the aircraft they have flown before, but they were more than capable of mastering it.
I believe they were very impressed with the capabilities of the F-16, and they approached it with great enthusiasm and were very pleased to be learning to fly it. And from everything I have heard from my colleagues who trained your pilots, they handled the task very well.
Was the prior experience of flying MiGs or Sukhois more of a hindrance or a helpful skill during training on the F-16?
A bit of both. I have also transitioned from one aircraft to another, and I am sure they had a similar experience. You develop habits from your previous aircraft because all fighters are different. It is not like renting a car. You can not just jump in and fly. They are all different, and you need to learn each one.
And sometimes, especially if you have spent a lot of time on a previous aircraft, you have to unlearn certain habits and develop new ones. So, in that sense, it was a challenge, but no more so than for anyone else. What really helped them is that they are used to flying at speeds of 400 or 500 miles per hour (643 to 804 kilometres per hour), thanks to their previous experience.
They are accustomed to thinking very quickly and operating a jet aircraft. So, these are all good qualities that carry over from one aircraft to another
Can you share how the F-16 has performed in other wars or against similar adversaries in the past?
I participated in both Gulf Wars (the armed conflict from 1990 to 1991, where Iraq faced a coalition led by the United States. - Author), and while those were not Russians, they were using Russian equipment and were trained by Russians. In both cases, after the first 24 to 36 hours, the enemy air force stopped taking to the skies and engaging with us because those who did never made it back home.
I do not take them lightly. I do not underestimate them, but I do not overestimate them either. They have very significant weaknesses, and we are aware of them. We have the tactics and weapons that we have passed on to your pilots to be able to combat them quite effectively.
If you compare all the weapons for the F-16 that have been provided or promised to us with the best Russian weaponry, who would have the advantage, in your opinion?
The F-16 has the edge. It has a much better radar and can deploy a wider array of weapons that we have, much more effectively than the Russians can. So, I am confident that your pilots have been trained on all of this. They know the systems, they know the weapons, and I am sure they will use them correctly. And Ukraine will be proud of them.
In 2022, Russia employed S-300 missile systems to strike ground targets in Ukraine. Now, Russian arms manufacturers have once again upgraded this surface-to-air missile defence system for ground offensive operations. Among your achievements is the destruction of 21 such installations. Ukrainian forces may also need to target Russian air defence systems from the sky. What are the biggest challenges in such operations?
This is a very complex question. The mission of hunting down and destroying surface-to-air missile systems is the most dangerous in any air force, in any theatre of operations. It is far more risky than close air combat or shooting down enemy fighters in the air.
The Russians, to their credit, have always had good systems, and they have many of them. One of the primary challenges in any of these situations is pinpointing their exact location. We have assets in space and other places that can locate them.
I hope that all this information will be passed on to the Ukrainian Air Force so they can use it to do what needs to be done to eliminate these air defence systems.
This project is co-funded by the Polish-American Freedom Foundation as part of the «Support Ukraine» program, implemented by the «Education for Democracy» Foundation
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Editors' Picks
IWONA REICHARDT: You were in the United States during the final stages of the presidential campaign, and you witnessed the results in Ukraine. Were they a surprise to you?
TAMAR JACOBY: I was – it was a punch in the gut. But I shouldn't have been surprised. Now that I look at the results, I think we all should have seen it coming. We told ourselves it was 50-50, but it wasn't 50-50. Trump won by a significant margin. I don't blame the polling – I don’t think that’s the main problem. I think that people just didn't want to see a Trump victory coming. I certainly didn't want to see it. Now we need to accept that Americans have embraced Donald Trump.
It's hard to understand why exactly. Is it that voters don't believe he'll do all the crazy things he says he will do? Or is it that they really just don't like the direction that Democrats were taking the country? Why this wholehearted embrace? I’m still struggling to understand it. But clearly Americans have embraced Trump, and we are going to have to accept the choice and live with it for four years.
Speaking of the crazy stuff you mentioned, one of Trump’s promises is to end the war in Ukraine in a day, something which seems inconceivable…
Yes, Ukrainian social media had a field day with that in the first days after the election: “The clock is ticking. Don, where is the peace?” But jokes aside, I don't think he will be able to end the war in a day. I think he will find it harder to end than he thinks.
The big question will be what kind of deal does he propose? I'm very concerned about some of the deals that his advisors have suggested. The second question is how will Putin react? The response from Russia in the last two or three days has not been particularly forthcoming. The third question will be how seriously will Trump stick with his proposal? If you remember his negotiations with North Korea in the first term, he gave up after just a few days of talks.
So yes, there are many questions about his promise to end the war in 24 hours. Also, when he says he's going to walk away from Ukraine – in fact he hasn't said that exactly, but people have read his comments to mean that. We don’t know what he intends. Does he mean no new weapons from the US, or an end to all support? Or does he mean that the US will continue to provide intelligence and let the Europeans provide military aid, including by purchasing US weapons?
Bottom line: there are many versions of what could happen now, and I think people should focus on making arguments that might persuade Trump to do the right thing rather than immediately assuming he’ll do the worst
What do you think success would mean for Trump when it comes to ending the war in Ukraine?
We don't know yet. Trump is a very reactive, emotional person. So, a lot depends on how it plays out. He won’t react well if he feels that Putin is snubbing him – that could work to Ukraine’s advantage. And he won’t like it if it looks like America has somehow failed and betrayed its ally. So we just have to see. There are many unknowns and many things that need to play out. What’s important now is to try to help Trump see Ukraine in a frame that could be positive.
This gets us to the Trump-Putin relationship. Who is Putin for Trump? A friend or a foe?
Unclear. But he is still definitely a foe for Ukraine and the rest of the West. And nothing suggests a change of attitude among ordinary Russians. Ukrainian social media monitors Russian social media very closely, and there’s been a lot of talk in recent days about how America is still Russia’s enemy and America will always be Russia’s enemy. One Ukrainian headline quoted a Russian saying, “Same jerk, different face” – meaning Trump is no different from Biden, And a lot of that attitude is fanned by Putin and his allies.
The big question about the negotiations is what will Trump put on the table?
If Putin walks away, I can imagine there would be consequences – I could see Trump hammering him hard. The question is, why would he walk away? If Trump proposes a freezing of the front line and a Ukrainian promise not to join NATO, why would Putin walk away? That’s my biggest concern. But again, we just don't know.
Also, let’s not forget about the fourth big player – Europe. You have Ukraine, you have the US, you have Russia, but you also have Europe. And Europe has to get its act together and step up. We could see a scenario where Trump backs away but says “Europe, it’s your responsibility”. Europe then has to find the money and the weapons, and step in. Europeans have been talking about these responsibilities since the war began, but they haven't really done much to increase their military capacity. Poland is spending more, but Germany is still spending almost nothing, and the German government has just collapsed. That is why I'm as concerned about what's going on in Europe as I am about what's happening in the US.
Do you think Europe, and especially countries such as Poland or the Baltic states, should worry right now? Does Trump’s victory mean we are more at risk of war coming to our door?
The bottom line is that Europe has to step up. No matter who is president of the United States. Even if Kamala Harris had won, Europe would need to get going. It is not enough to talk the talk – “We have to spend more”. Europeans have to allocate the money and cooperate with each other to make every dollar go as far it can. And they have to do it efficiently. There has been a lot of talk, but the train has not left the station. I understand – things take time in Brussels, and it's complicated. But come on, hurry up. People are dying in eastern Ukraine. And this war will come to Europe’s doorstep. The threats are already on your doorstep. And in this regard, I think Trump’s election might actually help – might push the Europeans to act in a way that the situation on the front line hasn’t pushed them.
Speaking about the front line, and the overall situation in Ukraine, all the prognoses are not optimistic…
It's not good. The Russians are relying more and more heavily on glide bombs, a brutal tactic. They destroy the place they're trying to take, and then they send in men. And nobody has figured out how to counter these attacks. These are old-fashioned aerial bombs with wings, and they're huge. When they hit, they can destroy whole buildings. And that's what the Russians have done – destroyed city after city.
Meanwhile, Ukraine’s ammunition is dwindling, and the men are tired. As I understand things, this summer’s mobilization drive has largely fizzled out, and desertions are up. The Ukrainian public is still hanging in there. Opinion polls don’t show much change in attitudes toward the war over the last six months.
Life is amazingly normal in Kyiv. For me, it's great to be back. But people are tired, and I think they are waiting to see how Trump’s election will change the dynamic
Ukrainians are so tired of fighting with one hand tied behind their back, getting some American and European weaponry but not enough and not permitted to use it as they think it should be used. I lot of people are eager for something bolder – and many think that may be Trump. Many people are worried about him, but some people are hopeful. Maybe Trump will break something – will somehow break the logjam.
Do you feel the sense of abandonment in Ukraine? Do Ukrainians feel abandoned by the West, by Poland, by the US?
Those countries aren’t all the same. I think most Poles understand what is going on in Ukraine – understand the existential Russian threat. Most Europeans get it. But most Americans do not get it. They don't understand the stakes or the magnitude of the threat, unfortunately. For most Americans, this war is very far away. And their view of the stakes is more transactional than existential. But even in Europe, let’s be honest, there is more talk than action. Abandonment is a big word, but maybe it's not far from the truth. It's becoming a lonely fight for Ukraine.
What is America going to do now, during this period when Joe Biden is a lame duck and Donald Trump is president-elect?
I do not think there will be another supplemental funding package from Congress. I just don't see it. Both the House and the Senate are now Republican and under Trump’s sway. Still, a few things could happen between now and January.
We haven't spent all the money from the last supplemental, and we should rush to do that
Senator Lindsey Graham has an interesting idea: giving Ukraine the same status as Israel, opening the way to much wider access to US weapons. It's not quite NATO membership, but it's a lot better than what Ukraine has now. We should also be looking at the rules that govern how American defense contractors can cooperate with contractors in other countries.
Many of these are small things, but the point is it's way too soon to give up. There are things that can be done in the US, things that can be done in Europe. Maybe most important is what Zelenskyy and others are doing – thinking about what arguments will be most compelling to the Trump team. All of these steps can make a difference, and we have to go on. The war is not over. Ukrainians are still fighting, and Russia looks as menacing as ever, for Ukraine and the rest of Europe.
Cover photo: 24th Mechanised Brigade named after King Danylo of the Ukrainian Armed Forces/AFP/East News
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Tamar Jacoby: It may become a lonely fight for Ukraine
«The war is not over. Ukrainians are still fighting, and Russia appears more threatening than ever to Ukraine and the rest of Europe» - an interview with Tamara Jacoby, an American reporter and Kyiv director of the «New Ukraine» project at the Institute for Progressive Policy
Iwona Reichardt
IWONA REICHARDT: You were in the United States during the final stages of the presidential campaign, and you witnessed the results in Ukraine. Were they a surprise to you?
TAMAR JACOBY: I was – it was a punch in the gut. But I shouldn't have been surprised. Now that I look at the results, I think we all should have seen it coming. We told ourselves it was 50-50, but it wasn't 50-50. Trump won by a significant margin. I don't blame the polling – I don’t think that’s the main problem. I think that people just didn't want to see a Trump victory coming. I certainly didn't want to see it. Now we need to accept that Americans have embraced Donald Trump.
It's hard to understand why exactly. Is it that voters don't believe he'll do all the crazy things he says he will do? Or is it that they really just don't like the direction that Democrats were taking the country? Why this wholehearted embrace? I’m still struggling to understand it. But clearly Americans have embraced Trump, and we are going to have to accept the choice and live with it for four years.
Speaking of the crazy stuff you mentioned, one of Trump’s promises is to end the war in Ukraine in a day, something which seems inconceivable…
Yes, Ukrainian social media had a field day with that in the first days after the election: “The clock is ticking. Don, where is the peace?” But jokes aside, I don't think he will be able to end the war in a day. I think he will find it harder to end than he thinks.
The big question will be what kind of deal does he propose? I'm very concerned about some of the deals that his advisors have suggested. The second question is how will Putin react? The response from Russia in the last two or three days has not been particularly forthcoming. The third question will be how seriously will Trump stick with his proposal? If you remember his negotiations with North Korea in the first term, he gave up after just a few days of talks.
So yes, there are many questions about his promise to end the war in 24 hours. Also, when he says he's going to walk away from Ukraine – in fact he hasn't said that exactly, but people have read his comments to mean that. We don’t know what he intends. Does he mean no new weapons from the US, or an end to all support? Or does he mean that the US will continue to provide intelligence and let the Europeans provide military aid, including by purchasing US weapons?
Bottom line: there are many versions of what could happen now, and I think people should focus on making arguments that might persuade Trump to do the right thing rather than immediately assuming he’ll do the worst
What do you think success would mean for Trump when it comes to ending the war in Ukraine?
We don't know yet. Trump is a very reactive, emotional person. So, a lot depends on how it plays out. He won’t react well if he feels that Putin is snubbing him – that could work to Ukraine’s advantage. And he won’t like it if it looks like America has somehow failed and betrayed its ally. So we just have to see. There are many unknowns and many things that need to play out. What’s important now is to try to help Trump see Ukraine in a frame that could be positive.
This gets us to the Trump-Putin relationship. Who is Putin for Trump? A friend or a foe?
Unclear. But he is still definitely a foe for Ukraine and the rest of the West. And nothing suggests a change of attitude among ordinary Russians. Ukrainian social media monitors Russian social media very closely, and there’s been a lot of talk in recent days about how America is still Russia’s enemy and America will always be Russia’s enemy. One Ukrainian headline quoted a Russian saying, “Same jerk, different face” – meaning Trump is no different from Biden, And a lot of that attitude is fanned by Putin and his allies.
The big question about the negotiations is what will Trump put on the table?
If Putin walks away, I can imagine there would be consequences – I could see Trump hammering him hard. The question is, why would he walk away? If Trump proposes a freezing of the front line and a Ukrainian promise not to join NATO, why would Putin walk away? That’s my biggest concern. But again, we just don't know.
Also, let’s not forget about the fourth big player – Europe. You have Ukraine, you have the US, you have Russia, but you also have Europe. And Europe has to get its act together and step up. We could see a scenario where Trump backs away but says “Europe, it’s your responsibility”. Europe then has to find the money and the weapons, and step in. Europeans have been talking about these responsibilities since the war began, but they haven't really done much to increase their military capacity. Poland is spending more, but Germany is still spending almost nothing, and the German government has just collapsed. That is why I'm as concerned about what's going on in Europe as I am about what's happening in the US.
Do you think Europe, and especially countries such as Poland or the Baltic states, should worry right now? Does Trump’s victory mean we are more at risk of war coming to our door?
The bottom line is that Europe has to step up. No matter who is president of the United States. Even if Kamala Harris had won, Europe would need to get going. It is not enough to talk the talk – “We have to spend more”. Europeans have to allocate the money and cooperate with each other to make every dollar go as far it can. And they have to do it efficiently. There has been a lot of talk, but the train has not left the station. I understand – things take time in Brussels, and it's complicated. But come on, hurry up. People are dying in eastern Ukraine. And this war will come to Europe’s doorstep. The threats are already on your doorstep. And in this regard, I think Trump’s election might actually help – might push the Europeans to act in a way that the situation on the front line hasn’t pushed them.
Speaking about the front line, and the overall situation in Ukraine, all the prognoses are not optimistic…
It's not good. The Russians are relying more and more heavily on glide bombs, a brutal tactic. They destroy the place they're trying to take, and then they send in men. And nobody has figured out how to counter these attacks. These are old-fashioned aerial bombs with wings, and they're huge. When they hit, they can destroy whole buildings. And that's what the Russians have done – destroyed city after city.
Meanwhile, Ukraine’s ammunition is dwindling, and the men are tired. As I understand things, this summer’s mobilization drive has largely fizzled out, and desertions are up. The Ukrainian public is still hanging in there. Opinion polls don’t show much change in attitudes toward the war over the last six months.
Life is amazingly normal in Kyiv. For me, it's great to be back. But people are tired, and I think they are waiting to see how Trump’s election will change the dynamic
Ukrainians are so tired of fighting with one hand tied behind their back, getting some American and European weaponry but not enough and not permitted to use it as they think it should be used. I lot of people are eager for something bolder – and many think that may be Trump. Many people are worried about him, but some people are hopeful. Maybe Trump will break something – will somehow break the logjam.
Do you feel the sense of abandonment in Ukraine? Do Ukrainians feel abandoned by the West, by Poland, by the US?
Those countries aren’t all the same. I think most Poles understand what is going on in Ukraine – understand the existential Russian threat. Most Europeans get it. But most Americans do not get it. They don't understand the stakes or the magnitude of the threat, unfortunately. For most Americans, this war is very far away. And their view of the stakes is more transactional than existential. But even in Europe, let’s be honest, there is more talk than action. Abandonment is a big word, but maybe it's not far from the truth. It's becoming a lonely fight for Ukraine.
What is America going to do now, during this period when Joe Biden is a lame duck and Donald Trump is president-elect?
I do not think there will be another supplemental funding package from Congress. I just don't see it. Both the House and the Senate are now Republican and under Trump’s sway. Still, a few things could happen between now and January.
We haven't spent all the money from the last supplemental, and we should rush to do that
Senator Lindsey Graham has an interesting idea: giving Ukraine the same status as Israel, opening the way to much wider access to US weapons. It's not quite NATO membership, but it's a lot better than what Ukraine has now. We should also be looking at the rules that govern how American defense contractors can cooperate with contractors in other countries.
Many of these are small things, but the point is it's way too soon to give up. There are things that can be done in the US, things that can be done in Europe. Maybe most important is what Zelenskyy and others are doing – thinking about what arguments will be most compelling to the Trump team. All of these steps can make a difference, and we have to go on. The war is not over. Ukrainians are still fighting, and Russia looks as menacing as ever, for Ukraine and the rest of Europe.
Cover photo: 24th Mechanised Brigade named after King Danylo of the Ukrainian Armed Forces/AFP/East News
I lie on a couch in a small kitchen somewhere in Warsaw, enjoying the aromas - onions, beetroots, carrots and tomatoes are quietly simmering in the pan. Such is the smell of the prospect of being fed borsch.
My friend is cozily bustling by the stove while I exhale my fatigue after an early flight from Paris. It is still 5 hours until my train to Kyiv, and I stopped by with a bottle of wine and a bag of sweets (there are also two little fans of Haribo gummy bears in this house). In return, I received coffee with treats, plenty of conversation and an unexpected homely feeling of comfort you only find at your mom’s or your other closest ones’ places, where you can visit without any formalities and shamelessly sprawl on the couch while lunch is being prepared.
Why have I not taken advantage of this great offer before? - I think to myself. After all, I fly often, and the opportunity to visit someone I know for coffee in a foreign city is a big help. However, this also concerns unfamiliar people.
I remember writing a Facebook post once asking if anyone was willing to let me in to take a shower at their place in Warsaw. I then received dozens of warm invitations, mostly from Ukrainian women I did not know. Well, now I actually do have a place to drink coffee and shower in almost every Polish or European city.
This is also a mark of our new reality: there are many Ukrainian women scattered around the world as of late, and the majority (at least, those whom I know personally) yearn for the opportunity to see each other, talk face to face and envelop their kin in their kindness.
My thoughts are interrupted by a joyful girl hopping into the kitchen on one foot. She is wearing a cast on her second leg, though she does not seem bothered by this problem at all. «Mom, you promised us lody (ice cream in Polish)!» Over two years of this family's life in Poland is evident in the way this girl and her brother communicate in a tender mix of Ukrainian and Polish words.
«Yes-yes, we’re going now», - my friend agrees, and like a multi-armed Indian goddess, she manages to simultaneously tend to her borsch, prepare the temporarily rented stroller, help her daughter get dressed for the walk - all with such ease that I’m candidly amazed by her.
- It’s the antidepressants, - she laughs. - You know, things have brightened up lately. I even realised I don’t yell at the kids anymore. At all! Can you imagine?
And so, I will spend a couple more hours in this house, observing this family’s life. Of course, my observations will be shallow and incomplete, the tip of the iceberg, so to speak, and even so I will still be able to experience many things.
«You know, I rarely even allow myself to have a glass of wine over here, - my friend says, placing the wine bottle I brought on the top shelf. - Just the other day, we had this broken leg from a bicycle accident… Ugh, what a nightmare it was. And I realised once again that I can't afford to relax even for a moment. Injuries and things like that always happen unexpectedly.»
How can I afford a moment of weakness or an unclear conscience if I am the only one responsible for the children here? I am the only adult here, you understand?
I’m not sure if I do understand, as I have never been in her place. And even though there were times in my life when my husband was on the frontlines, and I would end up being the only adult taking care of our son, my closest relatives and friends would still be beside me - what’s there to say - when you are home, even the walls seem to help.
While I can only wonder about what the displaced people have been through. The possibility of such an experience has always terrified me more than any attacks on Kyiv. But I would never ask my friend if she would consider going back to Ukraine while the war is still going on. I have never been in her shoes, I do not know all the circumstances. I do not bring up such subjects while talking to my friends who have fled abroad. Still, though, they always start discussing it first.
«I feel like I’m suspended between worlds, - my friend tells me. - I don’t want to put down roots in Poland, to build my life here. I want to go home more than anything. But...» Yes, there are plenty of these bitter «buts» in her life. This woman is divorced and is raising her children mostly on her own, she does not have a place to live in Kyiv, and the money for rent is scarce, as it is hard to find a job back home with her specific profession. And she has found a job here, in Poland. Not the one she’s dreamed of but she gets paid. And the kids have been going to school for two years already, learning the language and finding friends.
My friend’s son, who’s been diagnosed with Asperger’s syndrome, was fortunate with his school - he fits in well, which is very important. Her daughter enjoys going to various clubs, which are free here. And most importantly - the war in Ukraine is not over yet.
- However I constantly feel as if I’m doing the splits between two realities
«And the feeling of this perpetuating impermanence, and simultaneously of persistent root spreading in a country where I don’t plan to live simply destroys me. - she confesses, pouring odorous borch on my plate. - Even though I want to come home badly, I cannot bring myself to start the process of returning just yet».
Changed identities
Suddenly, I’m overtaken by a déjà vu, as I recently had the same conversation, and I was being fed the same delicious borsch in Vilnius. However, my friend's situation there is even more acute: she is a single mother of many children, and their home in eastern Ukraine is in a war zone. There is no way to return right now, and will there ever be any?
It’s difficult for her to keep her head above water in another country: her family does not receive any special support from Lithuania, and she’s paying for rent herself, which basically completely consumes her modest salary and her first-year student daughter’s scholarship. Her younger children study in school, catching up to their local classmates in performance, and her youngest daughter has adapted to the kindergarten’s environment so well that you can hardly tell which language is her first - Lithuanian or Ukrainian…
This friend of mine, a mother of five, has acquired a completely new profession abroad as a trolley bus driver. This responsibility terrified her at first, she even lost 10 kilograms during her first months on the job, but she has gotten around to it.
«What I’m grateful for, among other things, is that Lithuanians give forced migrants the opportunity to study for free. Yes, I have to pay back the money invested in me during my first 6 months on the job but I find it fair. I’m considering learning to become a bus driver as well. Not every Ukrainian city has trolley buses…»
This painful topic hangs between us.
My friend keeps on stubbornly planning her future in Ukraine, but right now, all her unanswered questions seem too resemblant to open wounds
Will their house in the Donetsk region still be around if their town is under constant fire right now? And if not, which Ukrainian city is ready to take in such a large family? How are they supposed to rebuild their life there once the war ends? And most importantly, - when will it end?!
As there is also the following problem: my friend and at least one of her sons have a strong reaction to shellings, having lived through the first difficult years of the war in their town. Unlike many Ukrainians, they have not adapted and have not learned to deal with their fear.
There are too many painful questions and too few hints on their possible answers. But my friend is so wistful of her home and talks about it so much… And not just home as a place to live - home in a much broader sense.
«I’m so worried for our nation’s future, - she says to me with an apparent aching. - Our greatest men die on the battlefield, meanwhile so many women have gone abroad with their children».
I listen and look at her with wonder because when I first met this woman, the questions regarding the Ukrainian nation’s fate seemed quite foreign to her, and the Ukrainian language and culture were exotic. Now everything’s changed. War, upheaval and new existential experiences are reshaping our identities, and each of us has our own path and pace. Some people, for instance, only realise their own Ukrainian identity when they lose the ability to live in Ukraine.
There are no easy choices left for us anymore
I have the privilege of staying home in the time of war. Of course, this is a conscious for my family and simultaneously a responsibility for all the possible consequences but it also is a combination of certain favorable factors. Unlike many of my fellow Ukrainians, my house is intact and I live in Kyiv, the most protected city in Ukraine at this moment, and luckily I have not lost the ability to make a living under the circumstances of the war. And there’s also a lot going on behind the scenes.
Undoubtedly, one can talk at length about the various drawbacks of this decision, but my friends and I, who have found ourselves on the other side of the experience, tread carefully on this thin ice. And yet, I am always amazed at how all of them - those who went to Poland, Lithuania, Germany, France, USA and so on, and have not made the decision to stay there - every time we meet, they start explaining and justifying themselves to me, as if the fact that I stayed in Ukraine gives me the right to judge them.
Hey, what are you doing?! No, there are no easy choices left for us anymore. Yes, it will always be a complex mix of entirely polar feelings.
And I listen to you, my dear friends, very carefully about all your tough calls and hard times and ask myself - could I have done the same?
And I cheer for you when I hear about your children’s or your own success in an unfamiliar foreign-speaking environment. I breathe a sigh of relief when such terrible trials as suddenly discovered oncology or other insidious diagnoses are treated for free and with quality in those developed countries where you have ended up. I am not annoyed by your everyday small joys that you are too shy to openly share on social media.
Moreover, frankly, I am proud of you - all these volunteer initiatives, the incredible projects you are driving in your new locations, all this great collective work for Ukraine, its military, image, culture and so on, all of this is very, very important. The Ukrainian diaspora is our superpower, I always say that.
But I won't lie, I often feel bitterness and resentment that the damn war has scattered all of you to distant lands, that prolonged stays in other worlds inevitably affect changes in your mentality and perspective. And it hurts me, God, it hurts me so much, too, that the flower of our nation has been so cut down on various levels.
However, I want to keep believing in our power and unity, I want us to stop bickering among ourselves and learn to listen to each other in this not-so-black-and-white reality. I want to feel that circumstances and distances can not take my close ones away from me. And that someday I will feel more or less at home anywhere, where I will be fed with sincere Ukrainian borsch.
…Having thanked my host for the hospitality, I’m leaving Warsaw once again to catch one of my many trains to Kyiv. I often travel this way and already have a collection of usual observations. These trains, connecting Ukraine and Poland, are always full of our women and children who are carrying heavy luggage, learning various languages (oh, the everpresent sound of Duolingo!), who have special documents confirming the legitimacy of their stay abroad, generously share the conditions of their new lives, complain or praise themselves, who are sad or laughing, explaining themselves or defending their decisions quite aggressively, even when no one challenged them. There is so much poignancy in all of this.
On the road, I observe the cheerful little daughter of another passenger for a while. She must be two or three years old, she’s active and constantly chattering about everything under the sun. However, I find it hard to understand her. «She speaks German better than Ukrainian now», - her mother says, embarrassed and almost apologetic to everyone. Well, that happens. Especially during the endless balancing between different worlds.
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The map of Borsch, bitterness and tenderness
I can only wonder what the refugees have been through. Possibility of such an experience has always terrified me more than any attacks on Kyiv. But I'd never ask my friend if she considered going back to Ukraine with the war still going on. I have never been in her shoes, I do not know all the details. I do not bring up such subjects while talking to my friends who have fled abroad. Still, though, they always start discussing it first…
.avif)
Iryna Tsilyk
I lie on a couch in a small kitchen somewhere in Warsaw, enjoying the aromas - onions, beetroots, carrots and tomatoes are quietly simmering in the pan. Such is the smell of the prospect of being fed borsch.
My friend is cozily bustling by the stove while I exhale my fatigue after an early flight from Paris. It is still 5 hours until my train to Kyiv, and I stopped by with a bottle of wine and a bag of sweets (there are also two little fans of Haribo gummy bears in this house). In return, I received coffee with treats, plenty of conversation and an unexpected homely feeling of comfort you only find at your mom’s or your other closest ones’ places, where you can visit without any formalities and shamelessly sprawl on the couch while lunch is being prepared.
Why have I not taken advantage of this great offer before? - I think to myself. After all, I fly often, and the opportunity to visit someone I know for coffee in a foreign city is a big help. However, this also concerns unfamiliar people.
I remember writing a Facebook post once asking if anyone was willing to let me in to take a shower at their place in Warsaw. I then received dozens of warm invitations, mostly from Ukrainian women I did not know. Well, now I actually do have a place to drink coffee and shower in almost every Polish or European city.
This is also a mark of our new reality: there are many Ukrainian women scattered around the world as of late, and the majority (at least, those whom I know personally) yearn for the opportunity to see each other, talk face to face and envelop their kin in their kindness.
My thoughts are interrupted by a joyful girl hopping into the kitchen on one foot. She is wearing a cast on her second leg, though she does not seem bothered by this problem at all. «Mom, you promised us lody (ice cream in Polish)!» Over two years of this family's life in Poland is evident in the way this girl and her brother communicate in a tender mix of Ukrainian and Polish words.
«Yes-yes, we’re going now», - my friend agrees, and like a multi-armed Indian goddess, she manages to simultaneously tend to her borsch, prepare the temporarily rented stroller, help her daughter get dressed for the walk - all with such ease that I’m candidly amazed by her.
- It’s the antidepressants, - she laughs. - You know, things have brightened up lately. I even realised I don’t yell at the kids anymore. At all! Can you imagine?
And so, I will spend a couple more hours in this house, observing this family’s life. Of course, my observations will be shallow and incomplete, the tip of the iceberg, so to speak, and even so I will still be able to experience many things.
«You know, I rarely even allow myself to have a glass of wine over here, - my friend says, placing the wine bottle I brought on the top shelf. - Just the other day, we had this broken leg from a bicycle accident… Ugh, what a nightmare it was. And I realised once again that I can't afford to relax even for a moment. Injuries and things like that always happen unexpectedly.»
How can I afford a moment of weakness or an unclear conscience if I am the only one responsible for the children here? I am the only adult here, you understand?
I’m not sure if I do understand, as I have never been in her place. And even though there were times in my life when my husband was on the frontlines, and I would end up being the only adult taking care of our son, my closest relatives and friends would still be beside me - what’s there to say - when you are home, even the walls seem to help.
While I can only wonder about what the displaced people have been through. The possibility of such an experience has always terrified me more than any attacks on Kyiv. But I would never ask my friend if she would consider going back to Ukraine while the war is still going on. I have never been in her shoes, I do not know all the circumstances. I do not bring up such subjects while talking to my friends who have fled abroad. Still, though, they always start discussing it first.
«I feel like I’m suspended between worlds, - my friend tells me. - I don’t want to put down roots in Poland, to build my life here. I want to go home more than anything. But...» Yes, there are plenty of these bitter «buts» in her life. This woman is divorced and is raising her children mostly on her own, she does not have a place to live in Kyiv, and the money for rent is scarce, as it is hard to find a job back home with her specific profession. And she has found a job here, in Poland. Not the one she’s dreamed of but she gets paid. And the kids have been going to school for two years already, learning the language and finding friends.
My friend’s son, who’s been diagnosed with Asperger’s syndrome, was fortunate with his school - he fits in well, which is very important. Her daughter enjoys going to various clubs, which are free here. And most importantly - the war in Ukraine is not over yet.
- However I constantly feel as if I’m doing the splits between two realities
«And the feeling of this perpetuating impermanence, and simultaneously of persistent root spreading in a country where I don’t plan to live simply destroys me. - she confesses, pouring odorous borch on my plate. - Even though I want to come home badly, I cannot bring myself to start the process of returning just yet».
Changed identities
Suddenly, I’m overtaken by a déjà vu, as I recently had the same conversation, and I was being fed the same delicious borsch in Vilnius. However, my friend's situation there is even more acute: she is a single mother of many children, and their home in eastern Ukraine is in a war zone. There is no way to return right now, and will there ever be any?
It’s difficult for her to keep her head above water in another country: her family does not receive any special support from Lithuania, and she’s paying for rent herself, which basically completely consumes her modest salary and her first-year student daughter’s scholarship. Her younger children study in school, catching up to their local classmates in performance, and her youngest daughter has adapted to the kindergarten’s environment so well that you can hardly tell which language is her first - Lithuanian or Ukrainian…
This friend of mine, a mother of five, has acquired a completely new profession abroad as a trolley bus driver. This responsibility terrified her at first, she even lost 10 kilograms during her first months on the job, but she has gotten around to it.
«What I’m grateful for, among other things, is that Lithuanians give forced migrants the opportunity to study for free. Yes, I have to pay back the money invested in me during my first 6 months on the job but I find it fair. I’m considering learning to become a bus driver as well. Not every Ukrainian city has trolley buses…»
This painful topic hangs between us.
My friend keeps on stubbornly planning her future in Ukraine, but right now, all her unanswered questions seem too resemblant to open wounds
Will their house in the Donetsk region still be around if their town is under constant fire right now? And if not, which Ukrainian city is ready to take in such a large family? How are they supposed to rebuild their life there once the war ends? And most importantly, - when will it end?!
As there is also the following problem: my friend and at least one of her sons have a strong reaction to shellings, having lived through the first difficult years of the war in their town. Unlike many Ukrainians, they have not adapted and have not learned to deal with their fear.
There are too many painful questions and too few hints on their possible answers. But my friend is so wistful of her home and talks about it so much… And not just home as a place to live - home in a much broader sense.
«I’m so worried for our nation’s future, - she says to me with an apparent aching. - Our greatest men die on the battlefield, meanwhile so many women have gone abroad with their children».
I listen and look at her with wonder because when I first met this woman, the questions regarding the Ukrainian nation’s fate seemed quite foreign to her, and the Ukrainian language and culture were exotic. Now everything’s changed. War, upheaval and new existential experiences are reshaping our identities, and each of us has our own path and pace. Some people, for instance, only realise their own Ukrainian identity when they lose the ability to live in Ukraine.
There are no easy choices left for us anymore
I have the privilege of staying home in the time of war. Of course, this is a conscious for my family and simultaneously a responsibility for all the possible consequences but it also is a combination of certain favorable factors. Unlike many of my fellow Ukrainians, my house is intact and I live in Kyiv, the most protected city in Ukraine at this moment, and luckily I have not lost the ability to make a living under the circumstances of the war. And there’s also a lot going on behind the scenes.
Undoubtedly, one can talk at length about the various drawbacks of this decision, but my friends and I, who have found ourselves on the other side of the experience, tread carefully on this thin ice. And yet, I am always amazed at how all of them - those who went to Poland, Lithuania, Germany, France, USA and so on, and have not made the decision to stay there - every time we meet, they start explaining and justifying themselves to me, as if the fact that I stayed in Ukraine gives me the right to judge them.
Hey, what are you doing?! No, there are no easy choices left for us anymore. Yes, it will always be a complex mix of entirely polar feelings.
And I listen to you, my dear friends, very carefully about all your tough calls and hard times and ask myself - could I have done the same?
And I cheer for you when I hear about your children’s or your own success in an unfamiliar foreign-speaking environment. I breathe a sigh of relief when such terrible trials as suddenly discovered oncology or other insidious diagnoses are treated for free and with quality in those developed countries where you have ended up. I am not annoyed by your everyday small joys that you are too shy to openly share on social media.
Moreover, frankly, I am proud of you - all these volunteer initiatives, the incredible projects you are driving in your new locations, all this great collective work for Ukraine, its military, image, culture and so on, all of this is very, very important. The Ukrainian diaspora is our superpower, I always say that.
But I won't lie, I often feel bitterness and resentment that the damn war has scattered all of you to distant lands, that prolonged stays in other worlds inevitably affect changes in your mentality and perspective. And it hurts me, God, it hurts me so much, too, that the flower of our nation has been so cut down on various levels.
However, I want to keep believing in our power and unity, I want us to stop bickering among ourselves and learn to listen to each other in this not-so-black-and-white reality. I want to feel that circumstances and distances can not take my close ones away from me. And that someday I will feel more or less at home anywhere, where I will be fed with sincere Ukrainian borsch.
…Having thanked my host for the hospitality, I’m leaving Warsaw once again to catch one of my many trains to Kyiv. I often travel this way and already have a collection of usual observations. These trains, connecting Ukraine and Poland, are always full of our women and children who are carrying heavy luggage, learning various languages (oh, the everpresent sound of Duolingo!), who have special documents confirming the legitimacy of their stay abroad, generously share the conditions of their new lives, complain or praise themselves, who are sad or laughing, explaining themselves or defending their decisions quite aggressively, even when no one challenged them. There is so much poignancy in all of this.
On the road, I observe the cheerful little daughter of another passenger for a while. She must be two or three years old, she’s active and constantly chattering about everything under the sun. However, I find it hard to understand her. «She speaks German better than Ukrainian now», - her mother says, embarrassed and almost apologetic to everyone. Well, that happens. Especially during the endless balancing between different worlds.
<frame>We present to you the following publication from the series «Portraits of Sisterhood». In it, we want to talk about the friendship between Ukrainian and Polish women, the support from ordinary people, and not only that - but also about the misunderstandings that ultimately led to new knowledge between the two nations about each other. Share your stories with us - stories of encounters with Polish or Ukrainian women that changed your life, impressed you, taught you something, surprised you, or made you think. Write to us at: redakcja@sestry.eu<frame>
I rehabilitated the children, and they did so for me
My path from the beauty industry and world runway podiums to charity and care over an orphanage was laid by losing my closest person. And it happened unexpectedly.
In the past, I was a sportswoman, I did rhythmic gymnastics. I earned the title of Master of Sports. I got into the «Khreshchatyk» Fashion house in Kyiv by accident: I came by it on the way to my Institute. Back then, it was the best fashion house for knitwear in the Soviet Union, it used to conquer the world runways. I saw an ad about an audition and decided to come along with my friends for company.
This is how my modeling story began.
I have been to many countries, including the USA, Brazil, Mexico, South Korea, Great Britain and almost all of Europe.
In 2002, when I had already been a recognisable person in the capital, my friend Ksenia Kuzmenko and I opened our own agency. Apart from modelling business, we also engaged in organising and producing the Miss Ukraine national contest. After we successfully managed to hold this contest at the «Ukraina» Palace in 2004 with a TV live stream, I was curious about how it was - being a contestant. I wanted to understand the girls better and support them.
Then I entered the Miss Global USA contest myself, and… was awarded the crown of Mrs Globe Europe.
I like art, and apart from modelling, I was passionate about cinema. One of the most memorable roles I have played was the daughter of a Polish duke in a movie about Bohdan Khmelnytsky. Before the full-scale invasion, I acted in a successful Ukrainian project called «Kyiv Day and Night». Life was very fulfilling.
But one day my mother suddenly passed away - and something shattered inside of me. We were very close. I did not want anything, I needed new meanings to keep on living.
When I was offered to lead the charity foundation responsible for the «Home of Happy Children» child rehabilitation centre, I was unsure I could do it. This is the place where they help abandoned children - some were simply found on the street, some were disowned by their parents, and others were taken from families in crisis. While the adults are taking care of legal questions and searching for new families for the children, these kids have the opportunity to live in comfort and undergo psychological rehabilitation. The team and I had to ensure all of this.
At first, I only visited but with each new visit I would get sucked in deeper and deeper: the kids wait for my visits, trust and attachments are formed. That saved me both then and now - during the war. Because everyone finds their inspiration and meaning in life in difficult times. I rehabilitated the children - and they did so for me.
The Power Woman
On the first days of the great war, artillery and air defence troops were placed next to our orphanage. We swiftly decided to evacuate the children, the staff, taking responsibility, transported them to safer settlements in Ukraine - wherever they could.
Offers came in to relocate the orphanage abroad but we were hoping that everything would pass quickly. At that time, everyone believed that this war would not last long. One such offer came from Olga Bohomolets [Ukrainian political and civil activist, Honored Doctor of Ukraine, - Edit.]: a family from Germany was able to help, provide accommodation and everything required.
That is how Elwira appeared in my life. We created the children’s evacuation plan working online with her in particular. At the time, I had no idea who Elwira Niewiera actually was, I had not seen her movies and did not imagine that I would be absolutely fascinated by this woman, having mutual sympathy and close friendship with her. A woman with boundless energy and desire to help. To me, she is now that very Power Woman.
At that time, Elwira had already been engaged in supporting our soldiers, it was she who managed to find a wealthy family from Bavaria that allocated and continues to allocate substantial funds to support the Ukrainian army, as she could not tolerate the inaction of the German government. A woman named Ulrike had a vacant villa next to a lake in the forest, and after careful consideration, Niewiera proposed to evacuate and relocate the Ukrainian orphanage there.
Leaving was complicated. Firstly, the war had already been going on for several months, and if previously there had been chaos and people, children and orphanages would cross the border without any documents, we, on the contrary, had to go through all the bureaucratic corridors and receive official permissions from four separate ministries and the military administration. And secondly, we had to literally «gather» 20 children from all over Ukraine: from Kyiv, Ternopil, Volyn’ and Lviv regions - everywhere they had ended up.
Elwira and von Walz's family organised the transport and relocation. On the Polish border, we transferred to another bus that brought us to our new home. It was scary for both children and adults - we were voyaging into the unknown.
Care with a capital «C»
In Germany, we became the only ones who, as an entire orphanage, including caregivers, found refuge thanks to a private initiative. I never would have thought that Germans are so capable of caring. You barely have time to think about it - and they are already doing it for you.
In the small Bavarian town, our bus was greeted by the locals, the mayor and even an orchestra. They closed off the entire highway for this. Everything was prepared in the house - even food and sleeping places for my dog and cat I brought with me.
.jpeg)
A year passed before we managed to organise a new way of life and accept the new reality that we live here, that today this is our home. And that we also live under one roof - 20 children and 10 caregivers - like a new family. Only in a year, when the initial stress had somewhat subsided, did we start noticing what a wonderful place we found ourselves in. The locals were helping as much as they could, they even organised sports lessons and activities for children. This is Care with a capital «C».
When Elwira visited us for the first time to get to know us with hugs and treats for the children, we arranged a party. She recorded everything on camera and promised to one day make a movie out of it. She found kind words and the right approach to every kid.
Later, in Amsterdam, where she had invited me to her movie’s premiere [«The Hamlet Syndrome» (2022), - Edit.], I discovered a different Elwira for myself: a talented director, a caring individual, who is not afraid of examining and finding solutions for very serious societal problems.
I remember how the theatre happened to us.
Niewiera’s friend came to visit the children - a director Rosa Sarkisian, who acted in «The Hamlet Syndrome». We had an idea of partaking in theatrotherapy: to express one's emotions and experiences and to talk about what hurts, through the persona of a certain character. This became a huge step forward in the children’s therapy. They carry severe psychological trauma with them but after talking about it even once - it gets easier for them. One week with Rosa turned out to be more effective than therapy with psychologists on the base of another centre.
We made a genuine theatre from these deep life stories. Imagine, Elwira organised a tour in Berlin! Our children performed on stage, there were stories about them in newspapers. It changed them completely, they became more trusting and confident, and the fear of opening up disappeared completely.
But most importantly - they were happy.
Act like a woman
I feel like Elwira thinks about Ukraine 24/7. And not just thinks, but acts. Every day. Recently, I came to her in Berlin for a weekend [Elwira Niewiera, a volunteer, Polish-German movie director and writer, is currently residing in Berlin, - Edit.] and she worked non-stop: she receives inquiries from the frontline, sends generators, night vision devices and drones over there. She especially helps women who ended up in difficult situations. It is just human, womanly. At this very moment, while I am telling you about her, she is busy finding a place to live in Kyiv for a woman who survived Russian captivity.
I don't know where she draws the strength to respond calmly in any situation, but I've never seen her lose her temper or get nervous. Inner calmness - is a great feat. At first, I was convinced she did yoga in order to achieve this - and started doing it as well because in working with children it is crucial to always keep calm, have your spirit up and be positive. Until one time Elwira asked me herself: «You know, it is so nice to spend time with you, you are so calm and peaceful. How do you manage to stay that way?»
I believe in women’s power. Sometimes it feels like men are not capable of agreeing and walking side by side, while women are. We have common sense and inner balance. We know how to stay composed and be flexible in critical moments.
Maybe I am only judging by Elwira or myself since I am confident to say that I am a strong woman. But she is absolute strength. She manages to not only reach her goals but to lead and support other people in the most difficult time
The hardest - letting the children go
Over the last 2,5 years I have been a cook, dishwasher, housekeeper, psychologist, doctor, driver, courier. I realised that when you acquire certain knowledge or skills, you need to use and develop them further, not lose them, because you never know how fate might unfold.
For example, I studied German at school but I never thought I would need this language. The women in my family were good cooks - but I never developed this ability in myself, until I had to cook for 30 people. I also became a driver since we live in the middle of a forest, and the children had to be taken to and from school and classes. Additionally, I have a diploma in medical rehabilitation. In Germany, it is a speciality in demand, and if I suddenly decided to stay, I could successfully work here.
Now, our children are coming home. Some get adopted, others return to their families because the court cases have ended or the parents have managed to resolve their issues. We have only three boys left as of today. I promised them they would graduate school here - especially the eldest boy because he is studying in a German class. In two years he managed to learn German from scratch, pass the exams on par with his German classmates, and he invited me to his graduation. The last time I was at a graduation was when my son finished school.
It is very difficult to let children go. Psychologists advise that one should immediately separate and communicate less. But in two years we have become a family, and I truly care about how the children’s lives unfold in their new families. I often consult with Elwira about the children, and we contemplate the best course of action together. She has seen all the processes from the inside and is my trusted person.
Meanwhile, our orphanage in Kyiv continues its work. We made sure to keep it clean and cosy and set up a shelter, but we still have not been able to find a psychologist. We are planning to invite Rosa with her unique theatre therapy method. Unfortunately, now more than ever, there is a huge number of children in need of help and care, and the country desperately needs such facilities.
On July 23rd «Home of Happy Children» opened its doors for new inhabitants.
And who do you think was the first visitor? - ELWIRA!
The text was prepared by Irena Tymotiyevych.
Photos from a private archive
20
хв
Exclusive
Portraits of Sisterhood
Відео
Фото
Подкаст
I am a strong woman. But Elwira - is absolute strength
I believe in women's power. Sometimes it feels like men are incapable of agreeing and walking side by side, and we manage to do it
Irena Tymotiievych
<frame>We present to you the following publication from the series «Portraits of Sisterhood». In it, we want to talk about the friendship between Ukrainian and Polish women, the support from ordinary people, and not only that - but also about the misunderstandings that ultimately led to new knowledge between the two nations about each other. Share your stories with us - stories of encounters with Polish or Ukrainian women that changed your life, impressed you, taught you something, surprised you, or made you think. Write to us at: redakcja@sestry.eu<frame>
I rehabilitated the children, and they did so for me
My path from the beauty industry and world runway podiums to charity and care over an orphanage was laid by losing my closest person. And it happened unexpectedly.
In the past, I was a sportswoman, I did rhythmic gymnastics. I earned the title of Master of Sports. I got into the «Khreshchatyk» Fashion house in Kyiv by accident: I came by it on the way to my Institute. Back then, it was the best fashion house for knitwear in the Soviet Union, it used to conquer the world runways. I saw an ad about an audition and decided to come along with my friends for company.
This is how my modeling story began.
I have been to many countries, including the USA, Brazil, Mexico, South Korea, Great Britain and almost all of Europe.
In 2002, when I had already been a recognisable person in the capital, my friend Ksenia Kuzmenko and I opened our own agency. Apart from modelling business, we also engaged in organising and producing the Miss Ukraine national contest. After we successfully managed to hold this contest at the «Ukraina» Palace in 2004 with a TV live stream, I was curious about how it was - being a contestant. I wanted to understand the girls better and support them.
Then I entered the Miss Global USA contest myself, and… was awarded the crown of Mrs Globe Europe.
I like art, and apart from modelling, I was passionate about cinema. One of the most memorable roles I have played was the daughter of a Polish duke in a movie about Bohdan Khmelnytsky. Before the full-scale invasion, I acted in a successful Ukrainian project called «Kyiv Day and Night». Life was very fulfilling.
But one day my mother suddenly passed away - and something shattered inside of me. We were very close. I did not want anything, I needed new meanings to keep on living.
When I was offered to lead the charity foundation responsible for the «Home of Happy Children» child rehabilitation centre, I was unsure I could do it. This is the place where they help abandoned children - some were simply found on the street, some were disowned by their parents, and others were taken from families in crisis. While the adults are taking care of legal questions and searching for new families for the children, these kids have the opportunity to live in comfort and undergo psychological rehabilitation. The team and I had to ensure all of this.
At first, I only visited but with each new visit I would get sucked in deeper and deeper: the kids wait for my visits, trust and attachments are formed. That saved me both then and now - during the war. Because everyone finds their inspiration and meaning in life in difficult times. I rehabilitated the children - and they did so for me.
The Power Woman
On the first days of the great war, artillery and air defence troops were placed next to our orphanage. We swiftly decided to evacuate the children, the staff, taking responsibility, transported them to safer settlements in Ukraine - wherever they could.
Offers came in to relocate the orphanage abroad but we were hoping that everything would pass quickly. At that time, everyone believed that this war would not last long. One such offer came from Olga Bohomolets [Ukrainian political and civil activist, Honored Doctor of Ukraine, - Edit.]: a family from Germany was able to help, provide accommodation and everything required.
That is how Elwira appeared in my life. We created the children’s evacuation plan working online with her in particular. At the time, I had no idea who Elwira Niewiera actually was, I had not seen her movies and did not imagine that I would be absolutely fascinated by this woman, having mutual sympathy and close friendship with her. A woman with boundless energy and desire to help. To me, she is now that very Power Woman.
At that time, Elwira had already been engaged in supporting our soldiers, it was she who managed to find a wealthy family from Bavaria that allocated and continues to allocate substantial funds to support the Ukrainian army, as she could not tolerate the inaction of the German government. A woman named Ulrike had a vacant villa next to a lake in the forest, and after careful consideration, Niewiera proposed to evacuate and relocate the Ukrainian orphanage there.
Leaving was complicated. Firstly, the war had already been going on for several months, and if previously there had been chaos and people, children and orphanages would cross the border without any documents, we, on the contrary, had to go through all the bureaucratic corridors and receive official permissions from four separate ministries and the military administration. And secondly, we had to literally «gather» 20 children from all over Ukraine: from Kyiv, Ternopil, Volyn’ and Lviv regions - everywhere they had ended up.
Elwira and von Walz's family organised the transport and relocation. On the Polish border, we transferred to another bus that brought us to our new home. It was scary for both children and adults - we were voyaging into the unknown.
Care with a capital «C»
In Germany, we became the only ones who, as an entire orphanage, including caregivers, found refuge thanks to a private initiative. I never would have thought that Germans are so capable of caring. You barely have time to think about it - and they are already doing it for you.
In the small Bavarian town, our bus was greeted by the locals, the mayor and even an orchestra. They closed off the entire highway for this. Everything was prepared in the house - even food and sleeping places for my dog and cat I brought with me.
A year passed before we managed to organise a new way of life and accept the new reality that we live here, that today this is our home. And that we also live under one roof - 20 children and 10 caregivers - like a new family. Only in a year, when the initial stress had somewhat subsided, did we start noticing what a wonderful place we found ourselves in. The locals were helping as much as they could, they even organised sports lessons and activities for children. This is Care with a capital «C».
When Elwira visited us for the first time to get to know us with hugs and treats for the children, we arranged a party. She recorded everything on camera and promised to one day make a movie out of it. She found kind words and the right approach to every kid.
Later, in Amsterdam, where she had invited me to her movie’s premiere [«The Hamlet Syndrome» (2022), - Edit.], I discovered a different Elwira for myself: a talented director, a caring individual, who is not afraid of examining and finding solutions for very serious societal problems.
I remember how the theatre happened to us.
Niewiera’s friend came to visit the children - a director Rosa Sarkisian, who acted in «The Hamlet Syndrome». We had an idea of partaking in theatrotherapy: to express one's emotions and experiences and to talk about what hurts, through the persona of a certain character. This became a huge step forward in the children’s therapy. They carry severe psychological trauma with them but after talking about it even once - it gets easier for them. One week with Rosa turned out to be more effective than therapy with psychologists on the base of another centre.
We made a genuine theatre from these deep life stories. Imagine, Elwira organised a tour in Berlin! Our children performed on stage, there were stories about them in newspapers. It changed them completely, they became more trusting and confident, and the fear of opening up disappeared completely.
But most importantly - they were happy.
Act like a woman
I feel like Elwira thinks about Ukraine 24/7. And not just thinks, but acts. Every day. Recently, I came to her in Berlin for a weekend [Elwira Niewiera, a volunteer, Polish-German movie director and writer, is currently residing in Berlin, - Edit.] and she worked non-stop: she receives inquiries from the frontline, sends generators, night vision devices and drones over there. She especially helps women who ended up in difficult situations. It is just human, womanly. At this very moment, while I am telling you about her, she is busy finding a place to live in Kyiv for a woman who survived Russian captivity.
I don't know where she draws the strength to respond calmly in any situation, but I've never seen her lose her temper or get nervous. Inner calmness - is a great feat. At first, I was convinced she did yoga in order to achieve this - and started doing it as well because in working with children it is crucial to always keep calm, have your spirit up and be positive. Until one time Elwira asked me herself: «You know, it is so nice to spend time with you, you are so calm and peaceful. How do you manage to stay that way?»
I believe in women’s power. Sometimes it feels like men are not capable of agreeing and walking side by side, while women are. We have common sense and inner balance. We know how to stay composed and be flexible in critical moments.
Maybe I am only judging by Elwira or myself since I am confident to say that I am a strong woman. But she is absolute strength. She manages to not only reach her goals but to lead and support other people in the most difficult time
The hardest - letting the children go
Over the last 2,5 years I have been a cook, dishwasher, housekeeper, psychologist, doctor, driver, courier. I realised that when you acquire certain knowledge or skills, you need to use and develop them further, not lose them, because you never know how fate might unfold.
For example, I studied German at school but I never thought I would need this language. The women in my family were good cooks - but I never developed this ability in myself, until I had to cook for 30 people. I also became a driver since we live in the middle of a forest, and the children had to be taken to and from school and classes. Additionally, I have a diploma in medical rehabilitation. In Germany, it is a speciality in demand, and if I suddenly decided to stay, I could successfully work here.
Now, our children are coming home. Some get adopted, others return to their families because the court cases have ended or the parents have managed to resolve their issues. We have only three boys left as of today. I promised them they would graduate school here - especially the eldest boy because he is studying in a German class. In two years he managed to learn German from scratch, pass the exams on par with his German classmates, and he invited me to his graduation. The last time I was at a graduation was when my son finished school.
It is very difficult to let children go. Psychologists advise that one should immediately separate and communicate less. But in two years we have become a family, and I truly care about how the children’s lives unfold in their new families. I often consult with Elwira about the children, and we contemplate the best course of action together. She has seen all the processes from the inside and is my trusted person.
Meanwhile, our orphanage in Kyiv continues its work. We made sure to keep it clean and cosy and set up a shelter, but we still have not been able to find a psychologist. We are planning to invite Rosa with her unique theatre therapy method. Unfortunately, now more than ever, there is a huge number of children in need of help and care, and the country desperately needs such facilities.
On July 23rd «Home of Happy Children» opened its doors for new inhabitants.
And who do you think was the first visitor? - ELWIRA!
The text was prepared by Irena Tymotiyevych.
Photos from a private archive
20
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Portraits of Sisterhood
Відео
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I am a strong woman. But Elwira - is absolute strength
Irena Tymotiievych
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«Though ravaged, our cities are alive». The story of a doctor from Donetsk who opened a chain of barbershops 20 km from the frontline
Nataliia Zhukovska
Together with her husband, Anastasiia Yaremchuk has already opened eight barbershops in Donetsk. The couple, both medics, were not afraid to start a business just 20 kilometres from the frontline. To employ locals, they had to retrain artists and locksmiths to become barbers. The staffing issue is one of the most painful, as people leave because of the proximity to the frontline.
Life in Uncertainty
In 2014, when the war began, I was finishing my internship in my hometown of Horlivka in Donetsk. However, living in the city was difficult due to frequent shelling. One day, the enemy bombarded the centre of Horlivka. There were many casualties and fatalities. I managed to survive. That day, July 27th, I will remember forever. It is my second birthday. That is when our small family made the decision to move to a safer place. We settled for almost two years in the village of Adamivka, 40 km from Kramatorsk. During this time, I commuted to the city for work. I worked as an assistant at the Department of Oncology and Radiology at Donetsk National Medical University. I only saw my eldest son, Timur, on weekends. He lived with my parents. To be together, we made another decision to move. There is nothing more permanent than temporary. This time, we moved to Druzhkivka in Donetsk, where I remarried.
.avif)
I met my husband at work - he is an orthopaedic surgeon.
On the day the full-scale war began, we found out we were expecting a baby. My husband insisted on moving, but I firmly said: «I am not going anywhere»
We persuaded our eldest son and my parents to move to Uman in the Cherkasy region. But we stayed. Our work did not allow us to leave the city. As doctors, we had to be at our workplace to help people. That separation from my son and parents was challenging. They eventually returned. In October 2022, I gave birth to my youngest son. What we endured that year, with no gas, no water for almost six months, and power outages - this toughened us, and it is now taken as normality. Unfortunately, you get used to it. The most important thing is that we held on.
A Barbershop
At that time, many women with children had left the city, but their husbands stayed behind. I noticed there was a demand for men's haircuts. I could not even book an appointment for my husband. It was a real problem. One day, I had the idea to open a barbershop with a men's section. I wanted to create something themed, something unusual. Barbershops were always named «Olena», «Natalia», «Anastasiia» and so on. We had many name options - «Cactus», «Razor». A coincidence helped us decide. My husband is from the Chernihiv region. One day, we visited Nizhyn. There is a pedagogical institute named after Mykola Gogol, a street with the same name, and we accidentally went into a café also called «At Gogol's». Inside, everything was dedicated to the writer. Stylish and thematic. So, as we were leaving, I told my husband that we should link the barbershop's name to a character. Since we are both fans of detective stories, we settled on the name «Sherlock». Then we started thinking about the attributes: a smoking pipe, a violin, a plaid, a desk, a typewriter, a magnifying glass, a microscope. And that is how we started to recreate an English style in the establishment.
The first «Sherlock» is a very small space, just two by three metres. There is one chair and a work area with a sink. There are banners with the «English Queen with Gum», photos of The Beatles, and posters of London. In the waiting area, there is a small vintage-style cabinet. On the wall, there is a typewriter. We created a cosy men's section, with a design I came up with.
We searched for all these items wherever we could. We bought the typewriter and violin on OLX. A colleague gave us the plaid in the English style. We have a few books about Sherlock Holmes, gifted by our barber Danylo. Clients donated an old machine and scissors
My husband and I work as two sole proprietors. We were able to start the business thanks to a microgrant from «E-support». My husband received a grant for barber services, and I got one for the development of a café. So, we also offer coffee at «Sherlock». The barbershop has been running for over a year, and we have been selling coffee for almost seven months.
The most expensive part was buying quality clippers, shavers, and trimmers. Additionally, one must understand that this equipment wears out. We rent the premises, so we did minor repairs everywhere. The grant support helped a lot. But we received it during the growth stage.
We opened the first two locations by ourselves. Of course, before starting the business, I calculated everything carefully. A men's haircut costs from one hundred hryvnias. We keep our prices very democratic.
The Biggest Problem - Staff
The first problem was finding specialists. There were almost none because many people had left. We searched for staff everywhere. Eventually, we decided to train those who were willing to work. This could be done in Dnipro or Kyiv. Our first trainee was our barber Danylo. At the time, he had just had a baby, and there was not enough money to support the family. The young man was talented and had little experience cutting hair while serving in the army. He quickly mastered the profession of a barber.
Later, two more specialists from other barbershops wanted to join us. So we began to expand. In Druzhkivka, we already have four establishments. There were also four in Kostyantynivka. However, due to the increased number of shellings, we had to relocate the business from there to Kramatorsk. For now, there is only one barbershop left there. Overall, we have 16 barbers working in two cities.
We have people with disabilities. We have an artist who works as a barber. In the café, the barista is a woman with six children. We also have a seamstress who retrained and is now a colourist and hairdresser
Women are amazed by her talents. Only two barbers were working in their profession. The rest we trained. We organised the training at our own expense. This was also a risk. There were cases where our employees, after training with us, went to competitors. But everyone has the right to choose. If one person leaves, two more will come. You should never try to keep anyone.
We have plenty of clients. Nowadays, we have versatile specialists. In addition to hairdressing services, the girls do eyelashes, brows and nails. As for power and water outages, we have adapted. Moreover, the situation is more or less stable now. We also work with battery-powered tools. We always have a constant water supply stored in tanks. Therefore, we can wash someone's hair or beard even if the city has no water.
20 km from the frontline
Chasiv Yar, where the frontline is, is very close - about 20 kilometres. Sometimes people ask me if we were afraid to open a business so close to the fighting. Yes, it is scary, but if you do nothing, it becomes even scarier. I had already experienced starting life from scratch in 2014. So I really did not want to believe or even think that we would face the same situation again and have to leave. I believe until the very end. I have no doubt that the region will endure. Even this close to the frontline, people still care about good haircuts.
I can not say whether people are leaving the city. On the contrary, some are returning. Home is home, and everyone holds on to their house, to their chance to be at home. Life does not stop
We have very clean and neat streets. There are shellings. You fear them, but you fear even more when they are not happening because of the waiting. It really weighs on your mind. But everyone adapts and tries to live. These are living cities. Yes, they are ravaged, but everything still works here. There are many entrepreneurs. As for how I cope psychologically, I just stay calm. My second degree is in psychology. I also find peace in my children and my work.
If I am busy, I do not analyse what is happening around me 24/7. My eyes are not glued to the battle map. I will not be able to hug the whole world and make the war end. Therefore, we must find happiness and balance in what we have. Pull yourself together. Currently, I work in Druzhkivka as a radiologist at the Central City Clinical Hospital, and part-time as a radiologist at the Kramatorsk Oncology Dispensary. And, of course, I also run the barbershops.
Plans - Business Expansion and Opening a School
We are on the verge of opening the fifth barbershop in Druzhkivka. In total, there will be seven. When we were buying a mirror and a small waiting sofa, my husband said: «Everyone is moving things out, and we are buying and bringing things in». I hope this sofa serves us for many years.
Our dream and plan is to open a school of hairdressing. We could train staff for ourselves and others. Healthy competition should exist, as the lack of it leads to complacency and no toughening. But this is all in the future. We would like to expand across the region, opening establishments in Kramatorsk and Sloviansk. I also have plans for the café. I really want it to be more than just a coffee-to-go point, but a full-fledged establishment.
Combining work and business is not easy. It is very exhausting. In addition, I am a mother of two children who need attention. My parents help me. Sometimes I can forget, for example, to deliver clean towels or pick up an order. But I have a boss, my husband, who helps with everything. We work as a single organism. What I cannot do, he manages. And it is very convenient when you work as partners. It is comfortable not only to be husband and wife but also friends and work partners.
As for the future, it is difficult to say what lies ahead. I remain very calm in any situation and try to solve issues as they arise. We need to keep an eye on the situation on the frontlines and prepare some alternative plans. However, it is essential not to forget that life is happening here and now. We must continue to work and live.
The war has taught me to appreciate my loved ones and every moment of life
By the way, my work in oncology has also taught me this. When I started working at the oncology dispensary, I was 25 years old. It is terrifying when you realise that it is not only war that can take away the most precious thing - life. That is why you appreciate every minute and try to do something good for your family. At this point, I am not considering moving, but if there is destruction and a threat to the lives of my loved ones, I will choose safety for them. Despite the war, I believe we have the best country, with strong education, incredible nature, and, of course, excellent doctors. I think people living in Europe now have long realised this. Therefore, I probably would not change anything in Ukraine. I would just somehow stimulate its development. I dream of the end of the war and stability. Also, after the war, I really want to send my children to my parents and go to Venice or Portugal with my husband. I am really craving some romance.
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Ukrainian business does not wait for the war to end
Irena Tymotiievych
The Union of Ukrainian Entrepreneurs (UUE) - one of Ukraine's biggest business associations- opened its first European office with headquarters in Warsaw on June 17th. This is a significant event for both Ukraine and Europe: it manifests not only the endurance and ambitions of Ukrainian businesses in times of deep crisis but also the readiness for integration into the European commonwealth. Among the main challenges of the agency are advocacy and support for Ukrainian business in Europe, making connections with international partners and attracting investments into the Ukrainian economy.
Photo: Union of Ukrainian Entrepreneurs
The Union's CEO, Kateryna Glazkova, often visits Poland and not only due to business matters: her children have been living here for over a year - 16-year-old Pavlo and 5-year-old Mark. She confesses she is a very anxious mother, and if her sons were in constant danger in Ukraine she would not be able to concentrate on her work goals. «I understand how hard it is for both those who stayed and those who left because I find myself on "both ends" every two weeks: at one time I am in Ukraine and the other abroad. I am much more effective at work now that I am sure my children are safe», - my interviewee shares.
We met in one of the Ukrainian restaurants near the Ukrainian embassy in Warsaw that made it to the list of the best establishments in the Polish capital a few years ago.
Irena Tymotiievych: Lady Kateryna, it is quite significant that in the time of the full-scale war, it is you who is representing a major part of the Ukrainian business in Europe. I think the role of a Ukrainian woman, especially a woman in business, is gaining a completely different meaning right now.
Kateryna Glazkova: A colossal meaning. In times of war, additional responsibility is placed upon a woman’s shoulders. Women learn male professions, and companies are more eager to hire them because the risk of mobilisation is lower. As we are literally losing men - more and more women will be taking key positions not only in the country but also within the area of international relations.
On the other hand, it could give us a certain drive forward. More often than not we, women, underestimate ourselves and do not believe in our own power. For example, in 2020, when our organisation tried to «portray» the Ukrainian entrepreneur and conducted appropriate research, we concluded that the owners of large Ukrainian companies were mostly men. And women, for the most part, own small businesses that often have a «glass ceiling» of development. Now is the moment when there is an opportunity and need to straighten our wings. Moreover, there are plenty of grants, support and educational programs for women entrepreneurs both in Ukraine and abroad. It is worth taking advantage of them.
Photo: Shutterstock
You have been involved with entrepreneurship for many years now. How is it - being a woman in the Ukrainian business?
Personally, I am quite comfortable in the Ukrainian business, despite it being mostly «male-dominated». Maybe I just got lucky or perhaps it is a personality matter. Entrepreneurs’ energy inspires me. They think differently and do not fall into disbelief: there are no problems - only goals. The word «impossible» does not exist to me, - that is what I learned from them. It can be «very difficult», can be «we have tried a hundred times but did not succeed», but «impossible» - is not an option for me and my team. If we, Ukrainians, categorised things as impossible, we would not have endured this fight for so long.
Without the economy, the war can not be won
The question puzzling the whole international community regarding Ukrainian business today - how is it possible that in the third year of the full-scale invasion, it does not only function but also demonstrates good positive dynamics: it enters new markets and implements innovative solutions?
We simply do not have a choice. Ukrainian business has unprecedented resilience. It is hard to explain to people who never lived in wartime what it means in practice.
In ten years of war and over two years of the full-scale invasion our entrepreneurs have learned to perform quite successfully, despite the constant shellings, blackouts, border blockades and employee mobilisation. And I am sure that cases of Ukrainian companies will soon be taught in international business schools.
In two years of the great war, the sole members of the Union of Ukrainian Entrepreneurs have invested 630 million euros into business development in Ukraine: reconstruction of destroyed facilities and warehouses, launching new products, entering international markets and implementing technologies.
This is our country and we believe in it.
Just like our defenders protecting the country’s borders on the frontlines, each of us at our positions has to do everything we can, and even more for victory. Ukrainian business is also performing its duty. Because without the economy - the war can not be won.
Notably, the UUE analytics centre conducted major research in 2021, not long before the full-scale invasion, regarding the attitude of various segments of the society towards stakeholders: the government, president, business, business organisations and oligarchs. The trust level in small and medium businesses in Ukraine was the largest after the Armed Forces - over 80 per cent. And if we combine the large businesses and business associations - it is an unprecedented percentage for Ukraine. For comparison, the government was only at the eighth place in the trust level ratings.
What is the cause of this?
In the country’s most difficult times, the entrepreneurs were the first to help. In times of Maidan, businesses gathered teams of young men and helped with food and money. During the pandemic, they bought equipment for hospitals, organised headquarters and delivered food to the elderly, who could not go outside.
And when the full-scale invasion happened - they evacuated people, provided them with shelter, brought them back from the occupied territories and fed them. Entrepreneurs gave away the supplies from their warehouses to guys and girls in the Armed Forces of Ukraine, sometimes even risking their own lives. At the moment the only source of financing for the army in Ukraine is the taxes, and each one of us who pays them is helping to win this war.
We have not done analogical research at this time, but the business has lived up to the community’s trust.
Are we talking about small and medium businesses right now?
About any businesses. Large included.
UUE - is also a representation of the state of the business. Our organisation has been active since 2016. Among its founders are both small and large companies like, for example, Nova Post, Rozetka and UBC Group. Now the Union consists of over 1200 companies from all regions of Ukraine. We function on the member fees that depend on the company’s size.
Photo: material from the press
In February 2022, we had a two-month decline for obvious reasons, there were no incoming fees: in such times, the Union membership fee is not the first priority financially. Additionally, the members of our collective were busy taking care of their families' safety in the first days of the war. And then they would get in touch with other organisation members to help each other out. They formed new priorities and reacted to new inquiries. I am proud of my team.
When we received the first annual membership fee from a small company in April 2022, we thought: «Finally, fresh optimists have appeared among us». Those five thousand hryvnias [approximately 120 US dollars, - Edit.] became a kind of symbol of trust and hope, that everything will be okay. And in the last two and a half years we have not only restored ourselves but also grown. We have a 35 per cent increase in members, there are new applications each week.
Ukrainian business - is about a high level of creativity. On one hand, there is strategy, but on the other - you always have to be ready for changes if a new challenge appears
There are no problems - only goals
Regarding the challenges. What does Ukrainian business live with now and how does it cope with it?
Firstly, there are obviously questions of safety. Safety of the workers, equipment and facilities. Larger companies invest wild sums of money into this. For example, after the enemy destroyed the Nova Post warehouse in the Kharkiv region - the company fully rebuilt it taking into account an improved safety system. This cost over 34,5 million hryvnias.
Photo: Vyacheslav Madiyevskyy/Ukrinform/East News
Secondly, the decrease in Ukraine’s purchasing power. The Ukrainian market has become too small, and because of that, companies are forced to move to international markets, even if they had not planned to do so.
At the same time, some sectors are growing. These are, primarily, the defence industry, goods transportation, medicine, suppliers of electrical/gas equipment that ensures energy autonomy, fossil fuel industry (for example, as of May 2024, «Ukrgazvydobuvannya» has increased natural gas production by 10 per cent) and the supply of energy resources, online trade, and the sale of agricultural products. If we look at growth by types of activity through the revenues to the State Budget of Ukraine for May 2024, we see that wholesale and retail trade, repair of motor vehicles, extractive industry and quarrying, processing, transport, warehousing, postal, and courier activities are growing.
The third challenge is the lack of people. There was a colossal problem with personnel even before the large-scale invasion, and during the war, it is a deep crisis that businesses can not solve on their own. Mobilisation, migration, a sharp decline in birth rates, and the loss of the working-age population require an effective strategy on the state level.
Money. They are always needed for development. And now they are needed for the sole purpose of survival. Generally, there is support, there are many grant programs from our partners, and we are thankful for that. But the queue for receiving available finances has become much larger.
How about the issue of inclusivity? According to the latest announced data, in two years of the full-scale invasion, the number of people with disabilities in Ukraine has increased by 300 thousand. How are companies adapting to these realities?
This is a new challenge that has not yet caught up with us but is already emerging. We are all just at the beginning of the path. For example, the UUE is currently looking for a lawyer in the team - a specialist who will work specifically with veterans' requests. For employees to return to their workplaces, it is necessary to go through all the required procedures, obtain a combatant status document, etc. We want to simplify these processes.
Meanwhile, the network of laboratories of the CSD Lab company, which is our member, is working to make each of its services accessible to people with mobility impairments - both for employees and clients. Some locations are planning to be re-equipped, and new laboratories are being built according to new standards.
There are many examples like that.
Entrepreneurs are very quick to react to all changes and implement innovative solutions.
Ukraine is already becoming a competitor and supplier of innovative solutions for many developed countries. In particular, the field of military-technical solutions has grown several times, and the Ministry of Digital Transformation has identified this direction as a priority for the coming years. How are companies showing themselves in this area?
For example, two of our members - IT companies STFalcon and Ajax - created and launched the mobile application Air Alert at the beginning of March 2022. It signals the missile danger in different regions of Ukraine. Currently, 6 million people in Ukraine have downloaded this application, including me. This year, Ajax also began producing surveillance cameras. This is an opportunity to occupy a niche that has always been dominated by Chinese manufacturers, but the market is now changing due to sanctions imposed against certain Chinese companies.
The products of other members, such as K.tex, a manufacturer of non-woven materials, are now used for sewing military uniforms and even for reinforcing defensive lines and critical infrastructure. Another example is Milliform, which relocated its production from Kharkiv to the Lviv region in 2022 and, by 2023, launched its own production of cosmetic containers with investments of about 600 thousand dollars.
This is also an answer to the question I am often asked abroad: Why should someone invest in Ukraine right now, despite the high risks? It is because the Ukrainian business does not wait for the war to end. Now, the air raid alerts and shellings are seen like the weather, which you have no control over.
I always say in cold business language: whoever came first - gains the profit. Consider it right now, look for partners among Ukrainian companies right away
According to President Zelenskyy, Russia has destroyed 80 per cent of Ukraine's thermal and a third of its hydroelectric generation capacity. How do you plan to address the energy supply issue?
Energy supply problems are not new, we stocked up on equipment and seemed ready for another winter. However, we did not expect the destruction to be so extensive.
To ensure uninterrupted production, some large companies have begun importing energy from the EU. For instance, the Nova group (which includes Nova Post) has founded its own electricity production company. Currently, the UUE is lobbying for legislative changes in Ukraine that will allow for the liberalisation of the electricity generation and supply market, which will promote the development of small-scale generation. It is much harder to destroy hundreds of thousands of small stations than one large one, which a significant number of consumers and critical infrastructure depend on.
We see a strategic path in developing distributed generation based on natural gas, renewable energy sources using modern mobile energy storage systems, and smart grids.
Distributed generation is favourable for investment, its cost is relatively low, and it takes less time to launch them into operation
Playing by new rules
One of the factors deterring investors from coming to Ukraine is the widespread perception of Ukrainian business as oligarchic. How strong is the influence of the oligarchic system on the economy and business in Ukraine now?
Ukraine has started playing by new rules. The elites are also changing. The influence of the former oligarchs on political institutions and specific politicians has significantly decreased. In agriculture, oligarchs are very conditional. There are questions regarding the finances’ origins, but now these are market companies traded on international exchanges.
At the same time, the influence of the private non-oligarchic sector is growing significantly. UUE is an organisation that fundamentally does not accept businesses connected with oligarchic capital. After the start of the war, we also began checking for connections with beneficiaries from Russia and Belarus. We take court decisions into account if there are questions about specific companies. In Ukraine, some data has been classified due to the war, but overall, the amount of open data in our country is one of the leading examples in Europe.
"The areas of our constant focus are the tax system, customs regulation, international trade regulation, public procurement, labour legislation, and the digitalisation of public services"
Photo source: Facebook
I have no illusions that all the oligarchs have gone under the radar - definitely not. But representatives of our association, founders, and members of the board of directors, are now part of many quasi-governmental institutions and influence decision-making. These are people who earned their money through their own efforts, hard work, and ideas
For example, there is the Business Support Council during wartime under the President of Ukraine. It consists of seven people, six of whom are entrepreneurs from the UUE.
There are concerns that a new class of oligarchs may form in Ukraine during the war. Are there such risks?
There are always risks. No country is perfect, and ours is no exception. The media, civil society, and the private sector have a huge role to play here: to do everything possible to prevent this from happening. There are many high-profile stories about corruption scandals in Ukraine in the media space right now, but there is also a positive side to this: it is a sign that corruption is being fought. Corruption was greater in silence. And if there had been no progress, negotiations with us about joining the EU would not have begun, as this was one of the three main points for starting the negotiations.
When the official negotiations for Ukraine's accession to the EU began on June 25, you wrote on your Facebook page: «I hope that in the process of these negotiations we will not compromise our interests, and the opinion of Ukrainian business will carry significant weight». What interests are you referring to, and what role does your business association want to play in this process?
For the business sector, joining the EU is a colossal stress, especially for SMEs [small and medium-sized enterprises, - Edit.], since companies have to comply with certain norms and standards: from environmental norms to minimum wages. But production processes cannot change overnight. In the negotiation processes on the government level, transition periods must be established in addition to the terms of trade. To avoid an unfortunate situation where we agreed to everything at once to quickly join the EU, but then were unable to fulfill the obligations on time.
Our business is competitive, but many companies need help to become so. For example, pharmaceutical companies need to re-equip. Large companies can afford to spend money on this, while small ones can not. Then it is also a matter of financial support. Within the framework of the single European market, some French company with extensive experience, support, and development over all these years, and without the war - without everything that Ukrainian business is currently experiencing - will definitely be more competitive than a Ukrainian one.
These aspects need to be considered so as not to «kill» the Ukrainian business. In this, I see our important role. On the other hand, we will encourage international companies to invest in Ukraine. We will not be able to manage without investments.
One of the most painful issues in the economic dialogue between Poland and Ukraine is agriculture. In your opinion, how should the Ukrainian business build a dialogue to avoid situations like the farmer protests we observed at the Polish-Ukrainian border?
We do not have large agricultural companies here in the UUE, as most do not meet our criteria. But why is this question directed at businesses and not politicians? Business simply does its job. If it produces good, competitive products, there are buyers. And in Poland, someone buys them, that's the market. If a business produces a bad product or imports it illegally, there are law enforcement and customs authorities, and court decisions hold the business accountable.
The incidents that occurred at the border - are beyond business logic, they are primarily political stories.
While Polish farmers protest against Ukrainian products, dumping the grain that people often collect at the risk of their lives, grain from Russia and Belarus flows into Poland. UUE, along with colleagues from leading Polish associations Leviathan and the Ukrainian-Polish Chamber of Commerce, raised this issue at the EU level and appealed to Brussels. Russia is trading grain here that it stole from Ukraine
I would very much like to convey this to Polish society.
From the perspective of economic relations between Poland and Ukraine, it is no secret that last year the export of goods from Poland to Ukraine was at a record high - 51,6 billion zlotys (12 billion euros). Poland's trade surplus with Ukraine reached 6,8 billion euros, a historical record. Meanwhile, imports from Ukraine to Poland have significantly dropped, especially after the embargo on agricultural products was imposed.
As for business matters, let's look at what some Ukrainian companies did when the transport collapse happened. Entrepreneurs calculated and decided that waiting at the Polish border was more expensive than redirecting logistics to Romania. And there, the port of Constanța accepted everything without issue. This is also a telling situation.
According to the latest statistics, every tenth business in Poland is Ukrainian. From my observations, it seems that Ukrainian entrepreneurs often target not so much the Polish markets as the «Ukrainian markets» in Poland. Some UUE members already have businesses here, how is the integration going?
Cooperation with Ukrainians is indeed smoother. Finding a Polish client or becoming a supplier for a Polish company is very difficult. There is a certain scepticism and media narratives that «this is temporary», «the war will end, and Ukrainians will return home». There is also the perception that Ukrainians are «unreliable partners» who work to «low standards», despite many examples proving the opposite. We opened an office here because we realised we need to build closer ties. We are conducting educational work on both sides to establish personal connections among entrepreneurs and build trust.
In this context, it is also worth mentioning the recent results of a study by Deloitte, according to which Ukrainians who arrived after February 24, 2022, added 0.7-1.1 per cent to the Polish economy's GDP (in absolute figures, this is 6-9 billion dollars). In the long term, this effect will increase to 0.9-1.35 per cent.
I am convinced that the share of Ukrainian business will increase, and competition with it will grow.
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«We still have not replaced the panoramic windows shattered by a shockwave»: Kharkiv coffee shop still pouring coffee in the city’s centre despite hardships
Yuliya Maleyeva
Fewer clients, increase in prices, new personnel due to migration, unexpected bills caused by constant power cuts (such as buying a generator or throwing away products gone bad because of unpowered refrigerators) - these are the least of the problems that the coffee shop’s owners Daria and Mykhailo Lazaryevs have to put up with:
- Many people left because of the uneasy circumstances, and it took its toll on the amount of clients. This is certainly difficult from a business point of view because we have rent and obligations to the collective, people need to be paid. But people left and there are fewer guests and smaller income, accordingly.
It is not about the income but blandly about covering the costs
It is difficult to carry out any activity today without positive thinking, which is why «LyaTyuSho» often holds various events - workshops, mini-fairs - where they collect donations for the needs of units fighting on the Kharkiv front, as well as for animal shelters. They also organise online consultations with a psychologist for visitors who follow the café's social media pages.
The story of «LyaTyuSho» began as a souvenir shop. Daria Lazaryeva explains that there were few places in the city where one could buy souvenirs. So, they set up a shop that sold postcards, pins, mugs, T-shirts, tote bags, and other small items. Later, they decided to establish a café here as well, so that tourists and local residents would visit. However, the souvenirs remained:
- We found a space and saw that it could also accommodate a cosy café. We wanted the people of Kharkiv to visit us too.
When we were thinking about the name, we wanted something local, something Kharkiv-like. «Lya», «Tyu» and «Sho» are popular exclamations among the residents of Slobozhanshchyna.
- Our philosophy is the development of domestic tourism. We are located in the historical centre of the city, so we wanted people to be able to learn something about it here, buy souvenirs, and get a guide to Kharkiv. And this idea still excites us. Recently, there have even been more tourists in the city. Now, there is a lot of press, foreigners, but they do not come because they want to enjoy our city. But this idea - to show Kharkiv - still inspires us, - says Darya Lazaryeva.
But to run a business in the conditions that Kharkiv is currently facing, you need to be flexible, Daria emphasises:
- You have to adapt quickly and respond promptly to everything. Last year, we bought a generator, and after that winter, we thought everything would settle down and there would not be any more problems. Unfortunately, that was not the case. For over a month now, Kharkiv has been experiencing constant power cuts, sometimes even outside of the scheduled times. You can not plan anything. The lack of electricity affects literally every process, from people not being able to get to work on time because the electric transport is not working, to constantly having to throw out spoiled food because the power goes out at night and the refrigerators stop working. Financially, this is, of course, very difficult. Emotionally, too.
For me, the people of Kharkiv are the strongest and unbreakable people emotionally and physically
Daria adds that she often has to «turn off the boss mode» because when explosions are echoing in the city, it is completely inappropriate to ask why the day’s earnings are lower - everyone understands the circumstances under which they are working and living.
The situation in the city is constantly changing. Many families have been forced to leave due to the increasing number of shellings. Despite this, the establishment managed to keep prices stable for as long as possible, only raising them relatively recently. What helps is that «LyaTyuSho» collaborates with Ukrainian producers:
- Working with Ukrainian producers is part of our philosophy of support and creating an ecosystem. We do not purchase products from abroad.
And when the Russians bombed the Kofein cafés in Kharkiv on May 6 2024, we encouraged people to support them and bought coffee beans there ourselves. We tried to support our colleagues this way
At the start of the full-scale invasion, 70 per cent of the staff had to be replaced due to the forced departure of employees. Those who remained in Kharkiv are now adapting to the new conditions, so even «work parties» have become thematic. For example, the entire team learned how to apply tourniquets and provide first aid.
Building any business plans in Kharkiv these days is a thankless task because nothing can be predicted, the businesswoman admits:
- Of course, all statistics have dropped, and it’s noticeable. It is difficult to plan anything right now. Over these three years of war, the statistics will vary greatly. In the first year after the full-scale invasion, there were hardly any people, everything collapsed. But if you look at the Autumn of 2023, there was an incredible surge in people returning. Overall, you make monthly plans for income and expenses, but it is all just «a shot in the dark» because, with every explosion, you realise there will be fewer people.
Despite this, «LyaTyuSho» donates a portion of its monthly profits to support the military and those affected by the war. The café also offers a «suspended coffee» service for soldiers (someone buys a coffee but does not drink it, instead «suspending» it for a soldier to enjoy later).
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«Vyshyvanka Expansion»: how Ukrainian woman combined ancestral memory, national identity and business
Yuliya Maleyeva
Step by step, Ukrainian designer Nataliya Yarysh brings her values to the world through her own business - a personal brand of vyshyvanky (Ukrainian national embroidered shirts). For her, Ukrainian culture, ancestral memory and national identity are not just fleeting trends but a philosophy of life that she has realised through her work.
Memories of a warm childhood
Nataliya Yarysh, the founder of the Svarga brand, hails from the Volyn region. Today, she runs her successful business in Lviv, but she still fondly remembers her childhood, which greatly influenced her personal development and is now reflected in her life’s work.
- I was lucky. I grew up in a large family in a Ukrainian village in the Polissia region, far removed from the folklore clichés nurtured by Soviet propaganda. I lived mostly in Volodymyr-Volynskyi (now the city of Volodymyr. - Auhtor), but I often visited my grandmother throughout the year, spending the entire summer at her place during school holidays.
Grandmother’s chest filled with linen clothing has permanently occupied a spot in her memory:
- I remember my grandmother’s house, her pantry and the enormous chests filled with linen clothes. I, a little girl, would quietly, as it was forbidden, go through the clothes while recalling my grandmother’s words: this - for your dowry, this - for burial, and this one - for special occasions.
I still remember that distinct smell - a combination of wood, powders and old linen
Her house was filled with embroidery everywhere. Patterns adorned pillows, tablecloths, napkins and towels that hung near the icons. My grandmother’s loving hands always sought to beautify the home and create a sense of harmony.
Every experience is a small step forward
Nataliya’s journey to starting her own business was a long one. Due to financial hardships, she had to take on various jobs, working with her family in the sugar beet fields, then at a sugar factory laboratory, and later at the employment office in Volodymyr.
Her introduction to the fashion industry came through another job - at the Volodymyr sewing factory «Luga». Here, her team, under her leadership, created their own casual clothing brand and opened a store in Volodymyr. There were business trips all over Ukraine - Kyiv, Odesa, Kharkiv, Donetsk, Luhansk, Vinnytsia - with constant meetings, negotiations and exhibitions. They even established partnerships with the United States and Germany.
Even though she already had an apartment in her hometown, a company car and a good salary, Nataliya felt an irresistible pull toward Lviv:
- One day, I was invited to the «Astron» clothing factory in Lviv. I agreed immediately and set off to Lviv with just a small bag. I bought a shop space, rented a rundown apartment and started a new life. Practically from scratch.
But «Astron» quickly turned into just another routine. However, the experience she gained there was invaluable:
- Once I mastered everything and understood the processes, I felt a lack of new impressions and opportunities for growth and expansion. When water stagnates, it becomes stale and murky - you need constant movement, change, fresh experiences. Even now, I can not stay in one place for too long. I will spend a week or two in the office, then I am back on the road. That said, I deeply value my work at both «Luga» and «Astron» factories. They taught me about the light industry, helped me understand the market, and allowed me to build business contacts, relationships, and perhaps even a reputation.
Her first independent business was founded together with her husband - a company called «Flex» that focused on home textiles. Starting from scratch was incredibly difficult, and to not just work to pay taxes but also generate profit, they had to find new ways to grow.
- There came a point when I realised that VAT would «eat up» our money, and I had to do something or I would not be able to pay our suppliers. So, I asked a colleague for a Japanese embroidery machine, priced at 60 thousand dollars, on an instalment plan. When we finally got that machine, it saved our future profits. I am endlessly grateful to the people who trusted me and were willing to meet me halfway, - recalls the entrepreneur.
When her marriage fell apart, they had to close that business. But instead of giving up, Nataliya decided it was time to take matters into her own hands and start making embroidered clothing.
The blank canvas on which the business was «embroidered»
Choosing a name for the brand took time, but after a few months, Nataliya Yarysh decided that the brand would be called Svarga.
- People told me the name was too difficult, suggesting I choose something else. But I trusted my instincts. If I liked it, then it was right. We chose a pattern that symbolises the strength of ancestry, the connection to the past, to traditions and values. I get chills when I physically feel the power of our logo, understanding that only this path, rooted in the past, was the right one and led directly to this realisation. I believe people have a written path, and everyone has their purpose. But there is always a choice. You can abandon your own path for someone else’s, and it is easy to do so. There are so many of those who forget their roots that it’s overwhelming.
The much more difficult choice is to stay on your path and not betray yourself
Today, Svarga brand's embroidered clothing is available on all major marketplaces, but initially, the company had to conquer the market:
- The way we grew is similar to embroidery itself. You start with a blank canvas, where nothing exists yet. You take thread and needle, and stitch by stitch, sometimes in very small steps, you move forward - building the team, developing marketing, acquiring equipment, setting up production, managing warehouses, operations, creating collections, finding partners. In our work, there are hundreds of details that require my constant attention as the leader. Especially when we need to be frugal, as we have to earn the money for our growth ourselves. Perhaps, with investors, things would have moved faster, but I feel we needed this gradual path.
After all, a large tree grows slowly. It roots itself and becomes stronger. We earned money, invested it into production. Earned again, reinvested in development
Now, Nataliya has six machines and her own stores. She explains that over time, they have become a unique phenomenon in modern Ukraine - not just a project or a business, but a part of Ukrainian culture.
Crisis as a catalyst for action
Eventually, they managed to establish wholesale sales, but of course, nothing is ever smooth. The business struggled to survive during COVID-19. Sales plummeted, but the company endured. It seemed like the business had adapted to the new circumstances when war suddenly struck.
- After February 24th, our production stalled a bit. No one knew which direction to move in, and we took a short break. About two weeks after the full-scale invasion began, Nataliya Yarysh signed a contract with a volunteer organisation, and we started producing sleeping bags for the military. This lasted for about two to three months, - says Yuliya Vasylchuk, the brand’s head of marketing.
Additionally, they worked with other manufacturers to produce plate carriers. The company also made military patches, responded to other military needs, and actively participated in charity auctions where their embroidered clothing was sold, with the profits going to support the military.
Once production began to recover, the question arose of which direction to move in next. Many of the ideas they had planned to implement were no longer relevant, adds Yuliya Vasylchuk:
- We decided to recreate the traditional vyshyvanky from the regions of Ukraine most affected by the war. At that time, these were the eastern regions. The Yavoriv military base also suffered heavily, which came as a huge shock to us. That’s when we created the Yavoriv-style vyshyvanka.
In this way, we chose to resist the aggressor. We wanted to show that we are stronger, that we are reviving - not just our economy, but our culture and traditions
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This is how the idea of the «Embroidered Ukraine» collection was born. It will feature designs from all 24 regions of Ukraine. The collection will be unveiled this May. This has been a new experience for us because we had to research and find the unique patterns of each region:
- This collection was created through trial and error. For example, we initially searched for random images online, checked if they matched the region we were focusing on, and then began reproducing the patterns for production. Later, we found out that some of these designs were copyrighted. To avoid violating any copyright laws, we started reaching out to the original designers. For instance, we pay royalties to the Honchar Museum for the embroidery pattern used in the «Kyivshchyna» shirt. Interestingly, this is the only museum in Ukraine that holds licensing rights for its exhibits, so we signed a contract with them.
Ancestral memory and interest in Ukrainian heritage
Today, there is a growing interest in vyshyvanky. Many people who were forced to leave their homes often mention that, among the few items they packed, they always included their vyshyvanka.
- We often see this pattern in our stores: customers tend to gravitate first toward the vyshyvanky of their own region. It seems that ancestral memory or some other subconscious process is at play here. Our salespeople have noticed this many times: when a person from Lviv comes in, the first thing they look for is the Lviv-style vyshyvanka. They might end up buying a different shirt, but that initial pull toward their native region is always there, - company employees say.
The war has been an immense challenge for businesses. For those in the clothing industry, so much depends on fabric and accessories suppliers. The uncertainty was compounded by fuel shortages, disrupted logistics and power outages. We had to think about things like generators to keep production running. Finding new fabric suppliers also became a necessity.
At the same time, global interest in Ukraine and all things Ukrainian increased, as our country was being discussed worldwide, says Yuliya Vasylchuk, the head of marketing at Svarga:
- We realised we needed to tap into this wave because our brand's primary mission is for every Ukrainian to own a vyshyvanka. It does not necessarily have to be from Svarga, but everyone should feel the value of our national clothing.
We want to show people that this is our culture, our legacy and that we must cherish it and pass it on to the next generations
We began actively researching traditional patterns and developing original designs. Of course, not everything went smoothly, and we made mistakes along the way, but we learned from them and kept moving forward.
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In Autumn 2022 Svarga presented the vyshyvanky of Franko’s family:
- We also started thinking about collaborations to not only support our own work but also others. For example, we noticed that museums were suffering too, as Ukrainians had stopped visiting them. So, we partnered with the Franko House Museum, and they allowed us to use their open archives. We recreated the embroidered shirt from Ivan Franko’s family. Later, we became interested in Hutsul tiles and created a Christmas collection featuring patterns inspired by this cultural heritage.
Another area of focus has been creative collaborations. One example is the matching «Borsch» vyshyvanky, created in partnership with chef and Ukrainian cuisine researcher Yevhen Klopotenko. Today, it is one of Svarga’s most popular embroidery designs. Nataliya Yarysh, the brand’s owner, met Yevhen while waiting in line at the border during one of her trips abroad. They started talking, and as Nataliya often says, «Similar attracts similar». They agreed to create something interesting together because both Yevhen in the kitchen and Nataliya in embroidery share the same message: Ukrainian culture is extraordinary and diverse, and the world needs to know more about it.
Later, Svarga introduced the «Dovbush» collection - a series of vyshyvanky inspired by the film directed by Oles Sanin.
Currently, the brand is focused on developing within Ukraine, but many of its vyshyvanky are being purchased by customers abroad. This includes both those who emigrated from Ukraine long ago and those who left after February 2022.
- Today, our customers have changed significantly. In the past, the vyshyvanka was seen as festive clothing - something worn once a year for a special occasion and then left hanging in the closet. Our philosophy, however, is about high-quality everyday wear. These are clothes designed for daily use because they are comfortable, beautiful and distinctly ours. Now, more and more people are embracing this idea, consciously wearing vyshyvanky and buying them for all occasions, - explains Yulia Vasylchuk.
In the fall of 2023, Svarga opened its second store - this time in the capital city. But the company is not stopping there. Plans are already in place to open another store in Kyiv, as well as in Odesa, Dnipro and Ivano-Frankivsk.
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